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****The Official 2014-15 NBA Thread****

Discussion in 'Other Sports Forum' started by schmolioot, Jul 7, 2014.

  1. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't think there is an argument to be made that if Lebron wins with Cleveland his legacy doesn't go to another level. If he won a few more with Miami no one really cares, if he could get to the point where he won something like 7 in Miami then thats different but say he wins 2 in Cleveland, it takes his legacy to a completely different level. We are talking about Cleveland man. Cleveland. ****ing Cleveland. Winning some titles with the Lakers or Celtics means something but carrying the Cavs? Its not even an arguable point, its a much bigger deal for his legacy if he can win in Cleveland.
     
  2. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You think Minnesota would take that trade? I don't.
     
  3. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    So you think one title in Cleveland is worth 7-8 straight finals and probably 2-3 more titles in Miami?

    I honestly don't. But its fine to disagree. Its a worthless point, he is there and he isn't coming back.
     
  4. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    Why? Bennett is a bust and Waiters is a role player. Waiters isn't terrible but he could be replaced fairly easily IMO

    You can say Bennett needs more time and Ill accept that but I'm not sure he's worth it.
     
  5. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yea, I would be tempted to just keep your 3 players that were top 5 picks and have them come off the bench. What's your cap situation like? I would just fill out the team. Back ups for Varejo and Irving and starter at PF.
     
  6. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    I don't think it's arguable either. Saying "it's Cleveland" over and over really isn't an argument. 20 years after he retires, half the people won't even remember where Lebron won his rings. All they'll remember is the total. And even if they remember it may not mean the same thing. Miami wasn't considered a powerhouse 20 years ago. What if Miami goes back to being a nothing team in 20 years or Cleveland becomes a good team. Nobody will have the perspective that the short-sighted are arguing will be important for his long-term legacy. It would be a bigger deal to win in Cleveland now, but then, who knows? I look at a guy like Dr. J who was the closest thing to MJ star status before there was an MJ. He finally got his ring, but my son who never saw him play wouldn't even think of Dr. J when talking about the great players. He just doesn't have the total rings to be in the conversation. But if he'd been signed by the Lakers and ended up with 4 or 5 championships, he'd be in the discussion.
     
  7. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    So...James Ennis.

    PPG: 7th in summer league. However he played only 25 minutes per game, second least out of the top seven. Most others hovering around 30 MPG

    Rebounds Per Game: 15th In Summer league. Pretty sure he would rank higher if not for centers and PF's so this is impressive.


    Field Goal %: .524% 7th most of players with at least 30 shot attempts, but was the only one with over 40.

    Also played strong defense. Can't wait to see him at SF this season.
     
  8. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    I do not think they would right now.
     
  9. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    I think Cleveland has almost no chance to win a championship the next two season w/o Love. After that if Kyrie develops and they're able to build around he and Lebron then they may have a chance to win. I just don't believe the odds are good that they'll make the right moves to make it happen.
     
    Alex44 likes this.
  10. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    They have a new GM, right? Shouldn't he at least be given the opportunity before you say something like this?
     
  11. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    Tristan is a starter at PF, with room to grow, although he may never prove to be a good enough fit.

    And either Wiggins or Waiters won't come off the bench (so not all 3).

    Cap situation isn't good, but it isn't bad, the Haywood contract (and AV coming off the book) next year will be the real lynchpin to making a move.
     
  12. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    I really think Ennis could be that offensive spark on the second unit this season. If he continues to develop he could earn starter minutes next year. His play style reminds me of Durant's. Not saying he's as good or anything, but their shots look very similar. I love Napier as well, but I think he's at least two - three years away from being a guy I'd trust to lead the team.
     
  13. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Kevin Love has never even played a playoff game or come close to lifting to Minny out of its annual doldrums.

    He's a stat filler who plays no defense.

    Is he a good player? Certainly. Is he a sure fire #2 on a championship team? I don't know.

    These same criticisms apply double to Kyrie who has had injury and locker room problems as well.

    LeBron isn't a miracle worker and you only have two years before he starts his decline
     
  14. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    I believe it starts at the top. So, no, I don't.
     
  15. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    Lebron is a physical specimen. I don't think he will decline in two years, he probably has a good four left in his prime and won't drop off all too much right away. He's a guy that could potentially play into his 40's barring injury.
     
  16. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Hm, I meant Thompson, Waiters and Bennet off the bench. Wiggins at guard. Fill out the rest of the roster with veterans.
     
  17. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't think that's fair to the GM but we'll see.
     
  18. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Two years before he starts his decline yet you were so upset with the fact that he left. Funny.
     
    Firesole likes this.
  19. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    So you're saying we should assume he'll make the right moves based on nothing? Reality is that winning a championship is difficult. You need to be both good and lucky. And we don't have any reason to believe he's either. The odds are against him. They're better with Lebron there, but even with Lebron, they odds are still against him.
     
  20. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    I don't agree that Lebron will decline in two years. I would guess that he has 5 or 6 more prime years barring some major injury.
     
  21. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    No. I'm saying you shouldn't assume he'll make the wrong moves. Like you said, we have nothing to base it on. He's a new GM. We have to let him make his way in this league.
     
  22. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I said "starts". Father Time is undefeated.

    When players hit 32 they start declining. Doesn't mean they won't still be great.

    Michael Jordan started becoming a jump shooter at that age. Even LeBron, with the minutes and amounts of games he has played will decline.

    It's why it was particularly stupid to leave the Heat now. Heat probably make two more Finals the next two years then see if the Cleveland kids show anything
     
  23. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Decline doesn't mean "suck". He will still be great, but his game will have to start changing
     
  24. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You made it sound like Lebron will be a shell of his former self. Yes, he will start to decline athletically. It will not hit them hard. He will still be Lebron. He's much more well rounded now.
     
  25. Limbo

    Limbo Mad Stillz

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    As things are right now Cleveland will be the favorite to make it out of the Eastern Conference THIS year.
     
  26. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    I think Indy should be if Lance comes back. Maybe Miami if they get Deng.
     
  27. 305

    305 Brawndo Club Member

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    Get off my lawn.
    [​IMG]
     
  28. Limbo

    Limbo Mad Stillz

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    Well the answer to these questions are available. I don't have an account for the most recent stuff, but Bovada's odds to win the NBA championship right after LeBron announced:

    Cleveland 4/1
    Miami 50/1
    Chicago 7/1
    Indy 18/1
    Spurs 5/1

    So yes, it appears LeBron is on a championship-contending team from day one.
     
  29. Boik14

    Boik14 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ive had the Love debate with a lot of Knicks fans who dont want him. Hes not a great defender but hes not Amare Stoudemire/James Harden bad on defense either. He gave up about a point per possession last year while having one of the best statistical seasons ever, not just for a PF...but ever. Only 4 other times in NBA history has a player made 50% from 2 point range, 38% from 3 (while taking 1 3 per game or more), 82% of FT's with 10 or more RPG and 4 or more APG. You put him next to a Carmelo or a Durant and a good defensive C and you'll see how good he is. Get some teammates around him.
     
    Fin-Omenal likes this.
  30. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    Ennis with another good performance in Summer League. 19 points and 8 rebounds. 62% shooting. Kid will contribute nicely next season.

    Hamilton and Napier played well too. The two Tylers are also intriguing players.
     
    SICK and 305 like this.
  31. 305

    305 Brawndo Club Member

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    Get off my lawn.
    Ennis has earned a roster spot... not sold on Napier yet though.
     
  32. Boik14

    Boik14 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Pierce to the wizards 2 years/11M
     
  33. NaboCane

    NaboCane Banned

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    As to Kevin Love: I'll take a 26/12 guy anytime and see what happens from there.
     
    Fin-Omenal likes this.
  34. JShady

    JShady Miami Heat lover

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    Still can't believe we drafted Shabazz Napier for Lebron and he ****s us, what a **** head he is, we could have got someone way better at that spot, **** you Lebron, you snake.
     
  35. JShady

    JShady Miami Heat lover

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    Go home me, you're drunk!
     
    GARDENHEAD likes this.
  36. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    Most don't so assuming he'll be the exception is betting against the odds.
     
  37. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    Change and decline have different meetings.
     
  38. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    With worse odds than any of the four Heat teams LJ was on and then they will face a deep Western conference. I don't believe the Cavs w/o Love have much of a chance to beat whomever comes out of the West. Since we're talking about whether or not Cleveland is likely to win a Championship, I stand by my statement.
     
  39. 305

    305 Brawndo Club Member

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    Get off my lawn.
    What are the odds that the AC will be out when the Cavs play at Miami :shifty:
     
  40. JShady

    JShady Miami Heat lover

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    It's going to be summer in December when they come play us for Christmas, arena temperatures expected to be in the 120s, Lebron is going to need a stretcher to carry him off the court.
     

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