How do Dolphins coach Joe Philbin, GM Jeff Ireland survive this?

Absurd article. Hyde is doing a fairly accurate Armando impression on this one.

 

good article...the answer is they probably won't.

 

I am afraid Ross is going to make another half *** measure.
Probably Philbin getting another shot with a new GM .

 

Martin is no victim, he is the perpetrator & victimizer of the entire Miami Dolphin franchise. to destroy the careers of a few good men & suffering the set back of a promising organization to square one isn't even the ugliest thing that could happen.
the franchise could be sold & relocated... the potential for total destruction of Dolfandom is a possible spin-off of Martin's hissy fit, that would be the second shoe to drop & final chapter to be written in the book of a great & proud organization.
hope the team makes it's statement on the field Monday night to a national audience. winning now & winning big for the rest of the season is the only option to derail this incessant, slanderous assault & get on with the business of continuing the development of a perennial competitive franchise.

 

It will be interesting to see how the league considers Incognito's behavior with the volunteer at the golf course. That could have been a criminal charge of fondling with an inanimate object. Philbin said they handled in house and wont disclose what the punishment was. The question is, did they do anything? I wish it could all go away and we could get back to football. I'd much rather read about the dolphins play rather than all this mess!

I know that has no bearing on the Martin, Incognito situation but it helps establish questionable behavior on Incognito's part.

 

Think Ross has shown his displeasure by being silent (hard for him) and asking the NFL to do an investigation and took it out of the in-house hands.That said, in hindsight by a fan, i wonder how much embarrasement would have been adverted by just cutting Incognito immediately & payin Martin for the rest of the year then offering him a free release to sign elsewhere. I wonder if that was what Martin originally wanted anyway. Both guys are too toxic to bring back and the lockerroom and leadership are being drug in now...

 

The part I liked is where you can opt out halfway through to view the top 100 dolphins cheerleader photos !

 

I think Cogs sexual harassment on the golf links is going to provide Philbin problems, he buried the incident around the same time he dismissed Chad Johnson after his arrest for hitting his wife, not only did he buried it but he let Cogs become part of the leadership council, it looks bad.

 

Toxic mess.... Comparing this to a Gulf Coast oil spill. That's absurd.

 

Personally, I am with Crunch, it's got to be either they both stay or they both go. At this point, all things considered, I'd say it's playoffs they stay, miss and they go. For the record, I would say that should be the case regardless of the Incognito-Martin issue. They spent poorly in free agency and it's showed; the bargain deals - Gibson, Grimes - were better than the big ticket names - Ellerbe, Wallace, Wheeler - and the team is 4-4; coaching has played a bigger part in that than anything else IMO.

 

Shocking. But I'll bite anyway....

- Declares Philbin and Ireland will be fired. He doesn't phrase it as a guess, he treats it as fact.
- Says the more we find out the worse it gets, even though, up to this point, its been the opposite.
- Claims the coaches let Incognito be a leader. the truth is that his teammates voted for him. I can only imagine the uproar if the players voted for a guy to be their leader and the coaches said nope.
- Brings up the golf course scandal as an indictment of Philbin and Ireland. As disgusting as that was, Bill Cowher and Ben Roethlisberger say hi.
- Implies nothing significant was done about it. It was an alleged incident. I don't recall anything going to the police.
- Claims that even though Incognito was sincere it and thereby not racistly threatening Martin, it was till a monumental mistake to have him work with Martin, then says, "We don't know all the details of what went wrong." So according to Hyde, we don't know what happened but its a mistake big enough to fire everyone.
- Mentions the threatening of his sister and being attacked by a teammate. Once again, treating Martin's camp's words as gospel and yet more or less ignoring the words from Philbin and players.
- reiterates Philbin is a new HC but then again claims he's not up to the job......all because of an incident we don't know what happened.

How is that NOT absurd, unless one has an agenda?
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I gave a pretty extensive list to back up my stance. Its you who is sticking to their previously held beliefs.

As to the one you pointed out out:

That is not how a person states an opinion. That is how a person states a fact.

 

Hyde has a lot of contacts in the Dolphins building so maybe he has a pulse on what will happen. He's an excellent reporter.

 

Well for one Cogs was able to pay the girl to be quiet about the attack but you're missing my bigger point and that is Philbin saw terrible conduct by a player and not only did he help bury it but then rewarded him with a leadership role on the team, we can try to play it down but that's how the story line is going to read and again it don't look good. And not saying it alone is going to bury Philbin but it's going to make it rougher for him.

And I know the team voted for him but its still Philbin's call.

 

So did Armando and the player mutiny that wasn't blew right the hell up in his face.

There's been nothing but a steady stream of misinformation coming from our local media for a week now.

 

They did do something they let Incognito be on the leadership council because it seemed like a good idea at the time to let a raging alcoholic with a checkered past , who assaults random women and yells racial epithets , on board as a leader .

Say what anyone wants to say about whose fault it is ....Martin's , incognito's , slimy lawyers ...whatever........one thing that is not in dispute is the fact that they let incognito be on the leadership council AFTER they cleaned up his golf course mess . That was just plain stupid .

 

The article is not absurd.

Even if you ignore the black eye the Dolphins have received over this story that got out, you still have a head coach and a coaching staff that is slow to adjust their game plan when things aren't working. They haven't exactly done a bang up job of putting the talent they do have in a position to make plays and succeed. This is a team that, to this point, does not handle adversity well during the course of the game. The fact that they held on to win the Cincinnati Bengals game doesn't change the fact that they have blown leads in the second halves of games all season long. I understand what Joe Philbin would like to be able to do with his offense, but he has to realize that he does not have the types of players he needs to run the offense he had in Green Bay. The pass blocking is not there. The route running is not there. Plus, you have a young, inexperienced quarterback who you are asking to make reads in complex passing concepts instead of simplifying things for him and letting him play off a running game.

From a management standpoint, you have the failure of bringing in the types of players needed to run what Joe wants to run. As CK detailed very well in his article, you also have a front office that has in general failed to add impact players over the past 3 years, as the biggest impact players on this team right now are players that were brought in when Bill Parcells was still around.

When you add all of that to go along with this black eye the Dolphins have received (along with the black eye of chasing a coach before you fire your current coach and the black eye of the Dez Bryant incident).

Don Shula also spoke out on this, saying that you win with good people, talking about how taking a chance on Richie Incognito has blown up on the Dolphins. He also stated that he hates to see the Dolphins in their current state and that the team needs to become credible again.

IMO, the only way we are going to gain credibility is to clean house and start anew.

 

This was your stance before the whole Martin blow up.

 

I agree with you Jim1.Any brain fart the previous poster lets leak from his **** mouth being anything in the realm of fact or even slightly indicative of rational objective thought: Thoroughly Debunked.

 

Why is there a leadership council to begin with? I'm sorry, but leaders are not appointed or voted upon. Leaders take control whether they are voted to a council or not. Don Shula didn't have any leadership council. He had players like Dan Marino, John Offerdahl, Kooch, Nick Bouniconti who were natural leaders.

 

Did I **** you and not call afterwards?

Seriously, who was your last avatar? C'mon, don't be shy.

 

He is stating that they both will be fired as if the evidence is strong enough to ensure they will. He made that statement and was supposed to use his article to back it up. I clearly laid out how he failed to do that. You have not laid out why I was wrong.

 

Everyone is interested to see how this team reacts on Monday night. The thread title says will the HC and GM survive this. Now it is all about one football game.

 

The fact of the matter is, even if Joe Philbin has no culpability with this situation, he's essentially guilty by association. No matter what the outcome of this situation is, this is the third instance of negative press this team has received in the past 3 years, only this one was much bigger and risks exposing the underbelly of what goes on in a NFL Locker Room.

 

I actually think Philbin should be fired simply because he's a bad coach, when you add the fact that he was either lying or was completely oblivious as to the state of his locker room then that just adds more fuel to the fire. I don't even remember Cam Cameron making the game day mistakes that Philbin has made. He's been a major disappointment.

 

The whole leadership counsel thing is not some NFL standard. It's just the players deciding who they want to "represent" them (I use that word loosely). That isn't Philbin, Ireland or Ross. The players or Philbin could snap their fingers tomorrow and bam, no leadership counsel. Pointing the finger at at "they" doesn't jive with me.

As far as the golf course incident, let me ask you all a question. Have you ever been arrested or have known someone to have been arrested? If so did you/them have the charges dropped by the DA or fight the charges and win? When that happens is everyone supposed to treat you poorly or different because you were charged to begin with but found not guilty? As far as I know Incognito wasn't even charged with a crime. So how is the organization covering up anything or how were they supposed to treat him? Should they have gotten rid of him or treated him poorly based on a crime he was never charged? What do you think his course of action would have been if they did that? I'm not defending his actions by the way. If he paid the girl to keep quiet, that's between those two. I'd let him rub my *** with a golf club for some scratch..

If there were locker room problems Martin could have handled it in house. There are right ways and wrong ways to address problems. I don't know the extent of what happened. I don't know Martin or Incognito. I do think Martin went about handling this the wrong way. My opinion is he threw a fit like a child and once the media honed in on it he had two choices. Tell everyone he had some personal issues to work out then go straight to his coach or start backing that bus up.

Beep, beep, beep...

The real victims are the other players, staff and fans of this team.

 

Why is Philbin being punished for things that happened 3 years ago?

 

It's unfair, but out of the three issues, this one is the worst one.

To me, a head coach has to be a strong leader, and that's the aspect I don't think I see in Joe Philbin.

 

I think Joe Philbin is perfectly fine. His been the only one out in front of this issue in recent days and has been forceful and clear like a head coach ought to be. I'm not entirely certain what the players think of him, but I suppose we will find out on Monday night.

Not Jeff Ireland, not Steven Ross, not Turner, etc. Those guys are conspicuously silent.

It is hard to hire a GM and not a coach, or vice-versa, and I can see Philbin's fate unfairly linked to Ireland in some ways. If Jeff is fired, then maybe we can pry a guy from Green Bay to be GM and co-exist with Philbin.

 

I want to see Joe adjust and coach to the strengths of this team from this point forward. Up until this point, or at least till the Cincinnati game, he coached this team the way he wants them to play, not the way they should be playing.

The Cincinnati game was different, but I'm not sure if that was an actual adjustment, or if it was something to was done out of necessity because your #3 wide receiver was hurt and your "blocking" tight end had to miss the game as well.

 

I agree KB, there is obvious room for improvement. There are bright spots too. I love how he called the first half of that New England game. I think we'd all like to see solid playcalling sustained for an entire game.

My opinion is that all this is to be expected in second year of a guy's tenure that has not previously been a head coach at any level. There are bumps to be ironed out but I think he is plenty bright and plenty serious.

That said, I would not hesitate to blow up the ship to hire Jon Gruden or Rex Ryan.

 

I say Philbin stays, the OL coach goes, and Ireland I have no clue but I'm leaning toward goes. He hasn't put the right players on the team. But Philbin definitely stays, if for no other reason than to show the Dolphins own up to their mistakes and correct them, with the people involved learning and establishing a consistent product after the fallout (no...not consistently bad...save it). I fully believe Philbin has what it takes to be a long-term, successful HC in the NFL, and I honestly worry about the Dolphins letting him go, and him getting a shot somewhere else and proving it. He's learning just like any other 2nd year head coach in the history of the NFL. The NFL's darling HC himself started off with some very rough years as a HC in Cleveland...now look at him? He can do no wrong ever. Even though he went against his normal standard and drafted a guy with GLARING warning signs, that ended up being a murderer, he's still god of the league.

WE NEED dependable, consistent, leadership, and I'm on the Philbin wagon. I'm just impressed by him. It's gotta start at the leadership.

 

They survive because the owner is Stephen Ross.

There ain't nothing in this dolphins organization worth keeping, including thw owner.

 

I feels like you're letting your take of his coaching color your take of his responsibility in this mess, when they are two separate things.