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Interesting perspective of former coaches and gms.

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Lee2000, Nov 4, 2013.

  1. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Without getting into detail about exactly was said, I found it interesting that former coaches are saying the veteran leadership should have detected this before it blew up. Forget that Ireland and Philbin didn't know. It should have never gotten that far according to players, coaches and gms. I don't disagree. It is a reflection on the locker room leadership. And listening to Wallace today didn't instill confidence in me that they get it.
     
  2. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I fully agree.

    But could you actually tell us to what you're referring?
     
  3. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    At this point its hard to say there was anything to detect. Need to wait until the truth comes out before condemning people.

    Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
     
  4. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    This makes me wonder to what extent Jake Long was pissed of at Philbin last year about the leadership council stuff.
     
  5. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Billick, Polian, Ditka, espn and nflnetwork folks. The Nfl network folks actually delayed discussion on this topic until at least 20 minutes into their broadcast at 7:00 eastern. I was particularily interested in what Billick and Polian had to say, both focusing on the lack of veteran leadership.

    Billick was particularily "perplexed" about how this blew up and got beyond the locker room.
     
    steveincolorado likes this.
  6. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    We had an awful lot of leadership let go this past off season.....smart....
     
  7. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The former players on ESPN seemed to have real problems with Wallace's response to the situation. A lot of references to the fact these guys had to know. The players, the trainers, other personnel would have to have seen something. The notice that younger players were led to believe certain behaviors were "normal", when they are not considered normal. Polian addressed the anti hazing policies he put in place, and he realized other clubs did not have these policies. Incognito would have never been on his club. Kind of an indictment of Ireland.
     
  8. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Who exactly are the members of the veteran leadership council other than Incognito, Ellerbe, and Wake? Who among that group would have had the balls to call out Incognito, or the maturity to take him aside and get results?
     
  9. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    Only one leader matters and it definitely isn't the mediocre left guard. Tannehill needs to speak up and become a vocal leader. This **** wouldn't be going down in Denver, Foxborough, Green Bay or even Indianapolis. One douchebag tries to rattle the chemistry and those quarterbacks will have their asses packing. Tannehill seems to have a passive attitude and honestly, in all of this mess this is where Tannehill needs to step forward and tell his offense to stop the douchebaggery and get to work, get a win Monday Night and everyone would shut up about Incognito and Jonathan. Both are **** at their positions anyways we don't need them.
     
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  10. TooGoodForDez

    TooGoodForDez Deion Sanders for GM

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    They were all scurred of Richie.
     
  11. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Leadership isn't what we thought it was that is for sure. Looking at who Ireland brought in: Ellerbe, Wheeler, Clabo, Wallace, Gibson. Strong leaders there?
     
  12. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    And this goes beyond a leadership council. The former players have made reference to veterans moving around in the locker room making sure things are ok among the team. Some one with an active pulse on what is going on.
     
  13. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    Of that that trio I would have thought Wake.
     
  14. fin13

    fin13 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Unless there was nothing to see
     
  15. fin13

    fin13 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    What do you base your comments on, your inside k nowledge
     
  16. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Stranger things have occurred, but you will have a tough time selling that to folks looking at this situation, including the NFL.
     
  17. ExplosionsInDaSky

    ExplosionsInDaSky Well-Known Member

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    What was Wallaces response? I've heard him speak many times and he doesn't come off as a smart human being.
     
  18. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That he didn't see anything.
     
  19. DOLPHAN1

    DOLPHAN1 Premium Member Luxury Box

    doesn't it strike anyone as odd that NO ONE saw this coming. at all. I can see some people not seeing it but no one? clueless or no clues evident?
     
  20. Zeke0123

    Zeke0123 message board ******* Club Member

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    They all spend a lot of time isolated in their separate rooms...not a lot of time for that stuff in practice but in your "room" watching film etc I'm sure that's where a lot of this happened and I could see someone being "sneaky" about it and making it hard to detect.
     
  21. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    What if nothing was happening? Dannell Ellerbe said if Martin brought it to the players attention (IE: made it known he didnt like something that was happening, or came to another teammate) it would've been stopped. Ellerbe said nothing ever was brought to ANYONES attention by Martin. If it did, it would've been solved.

    They can't read minds.
     
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  22. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    So it's ok if it doesnt get out of the locker room???
     
  23. unluckyluciano

    unluckyluciano For My Hero JetsSuck

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    I doubt a guy like wake would put up with that ****.
     
  24. Samphin

    Samphin Κακό σκυλί ψόφο δεν έχει

    You've got to be kidding me.
     
  25. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    What? I quoted a post of someone saying it shouldnt have got past the leaders in the locker room, I posted a quote from another leadership council member on our team......whats a joke to you?
     
  26. bakedmatt

    bakedmatt Well-Known Member

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    I have hard time believing all those ex-players on television were saints. They're lying. It does them no good to come to Richie's defense or to even downplay the racial slur and other talk, particularly when the league wants this fake squeaky clean image.
     
  27. Dolphins1Beatles

    Dolphins1Beatles Ziggy Stardust

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    This is a fairly interesting article: http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--d...n-t-immune-from-bullying-issue-232324913.html It's about how both of them seem to have issues that largely went ignored.

    Yes, another football player might have shrugged off teasing and vile comments. Another might have laughed or given it right back. Another football player might have just decked the offender. That doesn't mean, in the Dolphins' case, that Martin's decision to leave the team was weak. It might have actually been strong. It might have been the moment when Martin got sick of it all and decided to "man up." This could have been the instant when Martin's self-respect trumped his fear of a veteran or a boss. In that sense, Martin might have "manned up" just like Incognito did when he was younger. In fact, it's possible Martin's reaction was far more manly than it would have been had he clocked Incognito.

    Perhaps this could have all been avoided if NFL teams (and the league) did more to support consultation with on-site therapists. Incognito was on the Indianapolis Colts' do-not-draft list because of his character, and a recent profile of him showed how many demons he's had throughout his life. So what was done for him?

    "None of it shocks me," Giants kicker Josh Brown, a former teammate of Incognito's in the NFL and college, told Newsday on Monday. "This seems to be a person with a tortured soul. He has had his issues for quite a while I could say."

    Remember "Hard Knocks" last year? Chad Ochocinco walked into a Dolphins meeting room and basically told Joe Philbin and the other coaches that he was having issues at home. He was met with mostly silence. Ochocinco left. He was arrested later that summer for domestic violence, and he hasn't played a down in the NFL since. Same franchise, same inability to deal with emotional issues in players. Don't think it's just the Dolphins with this kind of problem. It's not.


    You can't save everyone, but you must try, especially while they're a member of your organization.
     
  28. Onehondo

    Onehondo Senior Member Club Member

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    There are two possibilities, either Martin didn't say anything to anyone, or else we really don't have any veteran leadership on this team. This an ugly issue that is getting worse by the minute. It seems like all of the media, ex- coaches, GMs and players are putting in their two cents worth. I would like to hear what Marino, or Shula, or even Jimmy Johnson would have to say about it.
     
  29. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The way other players outline it is they don't have to wait on others to come to them. They are supposed to know. I am sure you can go a lot of directions with that.
     
  30. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    The thing is...no matter how observant the players were within the locker room, I seriously doubt they had a copy of the texts and voice mails that really boiled this over. It's perfectly possible that the stuff going on inside the locker room was normal, everyday NFL crap that everybody has seen and participated in, but the other crap was the straw that broke the back. Either way...this is ALL conjecture, since nobody really knows all sides of this story...nobody on this forum anyway.

    My first reaction to this situation was, "WTF? Is Martin that much of a wuss?" Then I saw the voice mail/text stuff and I was appalled at Incognito's behavior. And I agree this never should have gotten out of the locker room...Martin should have went to Wake or Hartline or Tannehill, but that's neither here nor there...he chose the route he took and the rest is history.

    Mistakes in several different directions in this situation...I'd be very surprised if we have the same coaches and GM next year, and I can't help but wonder where Martin will end up.
     
  31. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That is not what they or I am saying. No, it isn't ok, but what they are saying is the locker room should have been a place the situation could have been addressed.
     

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