Who takes the hit???.Philbin or Leadership on team???

If this is truly a cover up from April, yep, he needs to go.
I'm not taking sides just yet because none of us really know much yet. Just lots of media talk right now.

 

Depending on what the whole story here is, I think this could be the last straw that ultimately leads to his dismissal.

 

You can't even keep your own bull**** straight.

...you've clearly taken sides and aren't even willing to look at any new info.

 

I think there are probably other reasons to fire him, but this situation reeks of a head coach that does not know what is going on in his locker room.

 

At very least, we can assume Incognito told him that.

I don't think that's really particularly nuanced view of depression or a lot of psychological issues. Him being good with it or happy at times isn't really indicative of anything.

 

what are the previous straws?

 

I thought you ignored me?

 

Martin left the team because of things Incognito did? What is the evidence of this? At this point all we know is:

-Martin left the team
-Was placed on NFI list
-Incognito left potentially bizarre and intimidating voicemail for Martin in April, the context of which could be anywhere from a drunk message in jest, to potentially threatening
-Normal hazing-type activities occurred within the locker room, such as rookies taking vets to dinner

Beyond that you're left to the conclusions being presented by the media.

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Again, when did he tell him that? If incognito didn't know about Martin's issues in April, then he didn't knowingly push a troubled person.

Sure it is. Again, you made the accusation that Incognito knowingly pushed a depressed person. If Ritchie sees Martin participating and having a good time, there's no reason to think he'd have a more nuanced view of depression.

 

Not for nothing but this whole thing may be more about Martin than it is about any substantial levels of harassment taking place. We do not know the details. If that's the case, the players may of been unaware of anything being wrong. If however the players had a sense that Incognito was being unfair and really getting to Martin, and they did nothing about it. That is a really poor reflection of their characters.

 

I think it was negligence, really lack of decency and maturity, since April.
Then this week, he admitted being in contact with Martin and his family throughout, they talked extensively.
The best he could come up with as an excuse for his absence during that time, is that Martin has emotional, mental issues.
Martin tweeted don't believe everythin you read, and then dropped the texts and voice mail to the league. In other words, Martin says I ain't crazy.
Then Ross stepped in, and Cog was suspended.
This is a massive fackup, and it goes all the way up to Ross.
Now Ross is calling in the big brother to do "unbiased" investigation, in a case that may go to litigation.
SMH. What a bunch of amoral fackups lead this team.

 

The teams results during his tenure here. He has not been that great of a HC

 

If you want to look at in the most charitable light possible, sure.

The fact that the Dolphins have suspended and will cut Incognito, and that the owner has called for an outside investigation and has hinted at the potential for further repercussions pretty well belies that.

 

Or its also just CYA.

 

depending on the details I am saying that. A HC along with his staff should be up on the team chemistry and they should be doing things to strengthen that chemistry. If they turned a blind eye or were caught unaware of this and it turns out to be a case of harassment. That is a failure by Philbin and his staff IMO

 

Sure. But given the tack of esteemed ThePhins poster mommabilly, I don't think the idea that it would have made a difference has a lot of traction.

As someone whom has admitted to being depressed before, yes, I think you can absolutely expect that.

 

That's not covering asses, that's burying asses six feet under.

 

Its not charitable as much it is factual. There aren't any other facts available.

Ross has not hinted at anything either. That's a narrative created by Armando Salguero based on his own assumptions and theories. Its not even rooted in a source.

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ehh I wouldn't be ready to throw the towel in just yet. The sample size is too small, what 24 games? I can see why some may call for Irelands head, but for Philbin I think it's a little premature.

 

you attaching that stigma to it, doesn't make it ross's meaning.

 

I respect that. If however it turns out that Philbin was encouraging other players to push Martin (not saying that happened) than something like that along with a mediocre record might lead to his unemployment. I do not think the Saints would of brought back Payton if he was not a proven great coach.

 

I think in the end we'll discover that Martin is a profoundly depressed kid, obviously on the edge of a mental breakdown and maybe worse, and Philbin is emotionally invested in the whole situation (not as bullying thing, but as someone worried about a sincere mental illness) partially because it is the right thing to do, and partially because of his own horribly tragic personal history. Incognito is part wrong place and part wrong time but ultimately needed to adopt a more leader/counselor role than his inner frat boy and failed to rise to that occasion.

That's my guess. Purely speculative.

 

Its fine if he wants to insulate himself from his players thinking of him as a buddy. He can keep the boss image. He has a staff that should be more attuned to the players and reporting it back to him. Turner is in charge of that unit, he should of been aware of a chemistry problem and he should of made Philbin aware of it if he could not fix it.

 

I'd say that's a good prediction.

 

One thing that bugs me is a locker room leader being a funny guy making jokes.
The other thing that shocks me is that people would actually think Richie isn't a jerk.
I wonder how many times it was said.... "That's just Richie being Richie."
Jonathan Martin can go away. I hope he never plays another down in the NFL.

 

On Monday night, a source said Monday's toxic news cycle for the Dolphins will seem, "like kindergarten," if other details come public.

-Dave Hyde

 

I think one of his big problems is that he gives the impression that he wants to be close to his players and be a "family", but in reality, he doesn't treat them as family.

 

stigma aside, it's telling where this FO was going and how they viewed the victim in the lockerroom, the way they think.
It's also telling that it took an official complaint and league's intervention to suspend Cogs.

 

that's pretty much my feeling on it. I could be wrong, but if it turns out Martin is suffering from depression, it will make a good amount of people on this board look pretty ****ing stupid.

 

not really. If you checked into a hospital to talk to a psychologist, I would assume your issue is mental and not physical. You are assigning extra meaning to them calling it a mental issue. Being depressed, etc does not automatically mean one is "crazy".

 

Eh?

 

Meaning, this isn't over. It's just beginning. A Dolphins source implies that there are a lot of non-public details of this case that if made it out to the public would dwarf the circus we've seen thus far.

It makes me think perhaps Richie Incognito's dad might have been telling the truth on some levels.

 

Is his source mommabilly?

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Didn't they say that Philbin picked Cogs as one of the leaders? Looks like one of the inmate leaders was running the asylum.

I'm ready to give up on Philbin, he has done nothing so far so show me he can do a good job & Belicheat got fired. I don't remember how Belicheat did back when he was a HC as the Browns but I beat him getting fired helped him become better at his job. Maybe being fired will help Philbin be a good HC down the road.

 

Sounds like more conjecture