Rosenthal / NFL.com - Top 10 QBs 25 or under: Ryan Tannehill

Stafford is vastly overrated, he has padded stats due to being a pass happy team who rarely was running the clock out in the 4th. He's not an accurate QB, and he has the best WR alive on his team.

Want nothing to do with him as MY teams QB.

 

Completely agree, over the course of his career, but not his first couple seasons.

 

Like many Dolphin fans, I hope that Tannehill turns into a top tier QB in the NFL. I just have to see it on the field on a consistent basis before I am willing to jump on the Tannehill bandwagon.

Last year he was about on par with Weedon as a starting QB in the NFL. He was far behind RG3, Luck, and Wilson as a rookie QB. He also didn't play anywhere near as well as Kaepernick, who only started for part of the season for the 49ers.

I think many people have been waiting for the Dolphins to finally find their long term answer at the QB position, they just want Tannehill to be the solution. Even if there are still huge questions regarding if he can be or not. A few years ago, many of these same individuals were convinced that Henne was the long term answer at the QB position for the Dolphins and we all know how this turned out.

Personally, I have no idea if Tannehill will turn out to be a top QB in the NFL or just another mediocre QB who will be replaced in a few years. I don't take seriously any lists which rank QB's who have only been in the NFL for a year or two.

As you stated, Tannehill has to prove it on the field. He no longer has the excuse that he is a rookie QB or that he has weak receivers. We will know a lot more about the prospects of Tannehill after the 2013 season is completed. Hopefully he will turn out to be the QB so many people on here expect him to be. If not, this franchise will remain a rudderless team, still looking for a a QB to lead the way.

To me the 2013 season isn't about making the playoffs. It is all about Tannehill and seeing if he is the long term answer at the most important position on the team. Hopefully his play in 2013 will merit the praise he has received from many individuals and he will make those players around him better. This was something he failed to do in his senior season at Texas A&M. I look forward to seeing how Tannehill develops during the coming season.

 

Disagree on Tannehill being "far behind the others". He has things to work on, yes, but the guy showed a lot of improvement as the season went on. He was also hampered by the knee issue, but he never complained or used it as an excuse. Griffin and Wilson went to mostly complete teams with outstanding ground games and good WR and TE play. They had it easier in many regards, and also didn't throw the ball as much as Tannehill was asked to do and they played behind better overall lines. As far as CKap, he wasn't a rookie, and he too was playing on a complete playoff team with excellent backs and pass catchers.

As far as knocking Tannehill for TA&M's record, his WRs dropped over 10% of the passes he threw and his defenses gave up games he had already led the offense to enough points to have won if they could have held on... Also, the college stuff is irrelevant at this point.

Tannehill wasn't even supposed to start or see the field most of last season, so he was already surpassing expectations of the coaches. Now let's see where he stands at the end of this season.

 

Yeah, that's when I started to like him as well...

 

I have no idea how you determine that RG3 and Wilson were drafted by teams which were more complete than the Dolphins. The fact is that in 2011, the Dolphins finished the season 7-9 and one of their wins was over the Washington Redskins. The Redskins finished the 2011 season 5-11 and the Seattle Seahawks finished the 2011 regular season 8-8.

It would appear that RG3 took over an inferior team to the Dolphins and made it a superior team. Wilson was actually the 2012 QB drafted in the third round who wasn't expected to come in and become an instant starter. In fact the Seahawks figured Flynn would be the starting QB and that Wilson would take a few years to develop.

Both these QB's came in and made the talent around them better. Tannehill on the other hand took a 7-9 team and led them to another 7-9 record. It seems to me that excuses are made for Tannehill, but people fail to realize that RG3, Wilson, and Luck all went to teams which weren't that good the previous year and yet they all made their teams and the players around them better, once they arrived. This is what quality QB's do.

Tannehill has yet to show that he can make the players around him better. He didn't do it in college and he failed to show this attribute in his rookie season. Perhaps he will continue to develop and he will become a top tier QB in the NFL. I believe he has an excellent arm and I think he is athletic enough and smart enough to get to this level. I just want to see it on a consistent basis before I jump on the Tannehill bandwagon.

I want Tannehill to be a huge success for the Dolphins. That doesn't mean that I am willing to just accept that he is the long term answer because some individuals think he has a big upside. This same statement was made about many young QB's over the years and in some cases it came true and in other cases, many of these young QB's never became quality starters in the NFL.

Right now I would take RG3, Wilson, Luck, and Kaepernick over Tannehill, but hopefully after the 2013 season is over, I will be happy that the Miami Dolphins used the 8th pick in the 2012 draft to select Tannehill.
To me the 2013 season is a make or break year for Tannehill, Ireland, and Philbin. There will be no more excuses for any of these individuals if the Dolphins once again fail to have a winning season.

RG3, Luck, Wilson, and Kaepernick all proved in 2012 that they were good enough to lead their teams to the playoffs. Now Tannehill needs to show he can do the same thing or else the Dolphins may be looking to upgrade the QB position when the 2014 draft rolls around. Personally I am tired of reading about how good Tannehill can be. Instead I want to see it on the field in the 2013 season. September can't get here fast enough for me.

 

How does Hartline have his best season (by far) and Bess was on his way to his best season and Tannehill not make the people around him better?

This is why this is so infuriating. A player can make other players around them better but there's still a ceiling based on the other player's abilities. Hartline would not have achieved even greater heights with other QBs. You act as if great QBs can raise a player of any level to unlimited heights...and that's not true.

 

Hartline and Bess were the best receivers simply because the Dolphins had no other NFL quality receivers on their entire roster. Tannehill had to throw to both these receivers because that is all he really had to work with. Hartline had one great game in 2012 and 15 very mediocre games. Other than the game against the Cardinals when he had 253 receiving yards, Hartline averaged only 55 yards a game over the remaining 15 games the Dolphins played in the regular season. I don't see this being the stats for a top receiver in the NFL. In fact this 15 game average was merely 20 more yards per game than he averaged in 2011, when Marshall was the teams #1 receiver.

I am sure if Marshall had been with the Dolphins in 2012, he would have been the leading receiver on the team and Hartline would have averaged 30-40 yards a game as he did previously.

I guess it is easy to overlook the fact that Bess and Hartline were thrown to more often in 2012 only because the Dolphins no longer had Marshall on the roster and the rest of the WR's on the roster sucked.

Tannehill may prove to be a great NFL QB and he just might start showing that he can make the players around him better. I want him to be the long term answer at the QB position for the Dolphins. Hopefully with the addition of Wallace and Keller and a year of NFL experience, Tannehill will start to show the improvement and consistency required of a quality NFL QB. I just want to see it on the field on a weekly basis before I buy into the Tannehill hype.

When you compare the stats of Tannehill in his first year as a starting QB in the NFL to the stats of Chad Henne in his first full year as a starting QB in the NFL, they are quite similar. I am not saying Tannehill will end up another Henne, but until he shows that he can take that next giant step forward, we really don't know if he will end up being a success in the NFL or just another first round QB who fails to live up to expectations.

I have said all along that this coming season is all about Tannehill. If he becomes the QB many feel he can be, the Dolphins will have their long term answer at the most important position on the team and the future will be bright. If he doesn't improve or his play is inconsistent, we will go into the 2014 off season still wondering if Tannehill will be the answer or if the Dolphins need to draft a QB in the 2014 draft.

I look forward to watching how Tannehill develops in 2013. Hopefully you can tell me after the season is over that ,"I told you so". Right now though, Tannehill remains the biggest question mark on this team heading into the 2013 season, as far as I am concerned.

 

This is exactly the flaw in your logic I was talking about. You think other QBs could have made Hartline a top WR threat. And you are wrong. There is a limit to a person's abilities and QBs are not made of magic. Tannehill made Hartline better than he ever was, he didn't turn him into Jerry Rice and no one could have. Your view that a great QB can raise any WR into a superstar is as rational as thinking there's bigfoot.

 

Don't see how you think these other guys are comparatively QB gods and Tannehill is Henne 2.0, nor how you can dismiss the talent around them as not contributing to their season, as well as not acknowledge the lack thereof around Tannehill.


Griffin and Wilson had the benefit of handing off to Morris and Lynch. Respectively, they were the #2 and #3 backs in the entire league last season and accounted for 24TDs combined. Bush was #17 and was worthless after the knee injury and as a blocker. Once bitten, he was twice shy about anything other than bouncing to the outside. Luck was handing off to nobody's in Ballard and Brown, who did little, and coupled with his WRs and TEs, is the reason he had 627 passing attempts.


As far as the WRs, Luck was passing to Reggie Wayne and the top 2 TEs in the last draft, as well as Donnie Avery and TY Hilton. Wilson had Sidney Rice, Golden Tate, and Zach Miller. Kaepernick to Crabtree, Manningham, Vernon Davis and Randy Moss.


These teams all had more talent around their QB last season. Tannehill had Hartline, Bess, Fasano, and Bush. Tannehill also had poor OLine play at both the guard and tackle positions. Yet, still, Tannehill was only behind Luck in passing attempts and far ahead of either Griffin or Wilson. Tannehill had 484 attempts for 3,294 yards. Griffin had 393 for 3200. Wilson had 393 for 3118. Kaepernick had the least with 218 throws for 1814 yards. You can easily see who had more talent around them, got more from less, and who's team made more plays for them, yet Tannehill still outpassed them with a worst OLine, WRs, and TEs...


He may not have showed you anything, but he showed me plenty to be excited about going forward...

 

Wait. There's no Bigfoot?

 

Yup. The tooth fairies hunted them to extinction.

 

you never factored in the fact that by the time all of those players retired there will be about 6-10 draft classes with better qb prospects then ryan tannehill.

it is quite absurd to say tanny is going to be top 5 based upon last years performance. extremely absurd in fact.

 

your wrong b marshall was the man with cutler. then henne came in and b marshall was not as good. then he went back to cutler and he is the man again. tannehill didnt make hartline better lmao. hartline stats would be better if tanny didnt underthrow so often.

 

Vicious little critters. So glad Hellboy took care of them too.

 

I'm feeling generous, so I'll give you another shot to make a coherent thought and then successfully translate that thought to the written word, before I (and any number of other people on this site) rip it apart. You're welcome.

 

So are your assertions... No one said Tanny was going to be Top 5 based on last seasons performance alone, but based on what he was able to accomplish based on lack of experience, his growth over the season, his toughness, his tenacity, his intelligence, and his intangibles.

Romo, Rivers, and Vick - now there is a laugh. 3 regular season guys who ever have accomplished what, other than choking and not being clutch?

 

lmao you suggested qbs are not made of magic and cannot improve a wr's game and that is as way off as its gets.

timing, accuracy, decision making, audibles, arm strength of a qb all factor into the success of a wr.

 

all your opinion. team was under 500 and his td to int ratio is laughable. you guys are really projecting your hopes and dreams rather then what really happened

 

No, that is not what i said.

I said they aren't going to take a Brian Hartline and make them a Jerry Rice. A good QB cannot make a WR better than they are capable of being, they can just make them the best they have the ability to be. For Hartline, the best he can be was what he did last year.

Following your incorrect "logic", Dan Marino could turn my fat *** into Mark Duper.

 

Of course these are my opinions... as those others are yours.

Tannehill's red zone options were what? Hartline gets by on smarts and being under-estimated by his opponents. He also has poor balance and is a #2 or #3 guy at best. Bess was slow and non-existent as TD threat. Fasano occasionally made a play. That leaves who?

The team was under 500 and his rookie TD to INT ratio wasn't terrible given the circumstances you refuse to acknowledge? Of course we want more TDs from him, that is why he has new WRs and TEs. As for the INTs, I would take him throwing a dozen or so INTs a season every season as long as he throws more TDs...

You're projecting him as a bust and a wasted pick. as for the "timing, accuracy, decision making, audibles, arm strength of a qb all factor into the success of a wr." - he displayed all that. Too bad you can't get by your bias, but of course you know more than the experts, who are all predicting his as having a bright future...

 

incorrect tannehill will be a serviceable starter and with the roster they have given him this season the excuses u have made will no longer be there. im not telling you tannehill is not going to be a top 5 qb off opinion. im simply using his body of work which is minimal. which makes it absurd to say he will be a top 5 qb

 

thank you for the sig addition.

 

no problem. it makes more sense then u ever will.

 

lmao your right larry fitzgerald's ceiling was the same when kurt warner was qb as it was when john skelton was qb.

 

Read the next part slowly.

Larry Fitzgerald's ceiling is the same regardless of who his QB is. The difference is a good QB like Warner will get him to achieve it and a bad QB like Skelton will not.

I challenge you to take a break from posting and practice thinking for a little bit, then come back.

 

A servicable starter... like Rivers, Romo, or Vick... lol... Geeze, I have much more hope for Tannehill.

So you're basing your opinion off his "body of work which is minimal", which doesn't account for his lack of weapons, options, or Oline. Ok... GTK.

Glad the coaches don't just base things off a guy's body of work his rookie season... RJones would have been long gone. Same with most rookies...

 

your proving my point dummie. the better the qb is that season the higher the ceiling is. cause in reality a persons "ceiling" isnt real. it is simply opinion. therefore the better the qb the higher the imaginary "ceiling"

this rule of thumb is excercised in every position in fantasy football drafts

fitz skills are better then anybody in the nfl but his ceiling for this season will live and die with who is qb is

 

we will be lucky if he turns out to be as good as those 3. so far he hasnt proven he can hold there jock strap.

 

Exactly. He is using the term "ceiling" when he means "production"... Fitz will never have the production with a QB like Skelton that he had with Warner. Fitz's "ceiling" however, will always be high regardless of who the QB is... a shame we had BMarshall instead of Fitzy. Tanny to Fitzy would have been dynamite last season. ~sighs

 

Lucky to be as good? F that. If he isn't better than any of those 3, I will be sorely disappointed. I think all 3 are over-hyped and haven't accomplished anything of note. SD surely regrets Rivers over Brees. Romo is a choker, and Vick never lived up to his potential and wasted his best years being a punk in Atlanta.

 

Sigh.

Following your frankly, ******ed logic, a good enough QB can make any WR an actual super hero. Forget Jerry Rice, he could have been better, if he had an even better QB. There's no end in ability any WR can show until the point they can do superhuman feats like run the length of the field in 2 seconds as long as the QB is great.

You cannot be real. There's just no way you exist.

 

The word "ceiling" is used to suggest a players potential production.

 

Psssttt... if you're going to call someone a "dummy" online, you should at least spell it correctly. Free advice, freely given... I disagree with your statements, but some of it is you interpretation of the word "ceiling"... Agree that Fitz is a TOP 3 WR and that his "production" will only be as good as his QBs ability to get him the ball.

 

if the qb is better then joe montana then ya perhaps jerry rices stats would be better. wr ceiling can only be determined factoring in qb play. one cannot be successful without the other. one can raise ones ceiling and one can drop ones ceiling

yall said yourself tannys ceiling is higher with better wr's. yalll in exact words said he didnt have weapons last year so this year he should be better. lmao

 

your whole argument that tannehill will be better because of his weapons suggests that other players will make him better but yet your calling my logic dumb. you are contradicting yourself every post you argue with me

 

Seriously, get a tutor, have the tutor read my posts, then explain them to you in a way you can understand.

 

No... what is being stated is that Tannehill had limited options last season in which to block for him or to throw the ball to... unless you honestly think that he should have gotten the same production (or "ceiling" in your terms) from Hartline, Bess, and Fanaso that a guy like Romo got from Dez Bryant, Jason Wittens, Miles Austin, and kevin Ogletree...

 

First of all, I wouldn't consider a WR who had just one TD catch a, "WR threat". As I pointed out, I think that other than one game last year, Hartline was a very mediocre WR in the NFL. I also believe that without any other legitimate WR's on the roster, except for Bess, any average QB in the NFL would have be able to average 55 yards a game passing the ball to Hartline. Since just like Tannehill, this QB would have had limited choices because of the terrible WR corp of the Dolphins.

In fact I have no doubt that Hartline would have had similar receiving stats if Moore or even Devlin had been the starting QB of the Dolphins in 2012.

You refer to my flaw in logic, but you fail to recognize that there was no true #1 receiver on the roster and Tannehill was forced to pass to Hartline and Bess because he had no other legitimate WR's to throw the ball to.

If you basically only have two WR's on your roster who are legitimate NFL WR's, you have no choice but to throw the ball to them. It wasn't Tannehill who was responsible for the additional yards Hartline and Bess had in 2012. It was the lack of other options which led to this increase in their catches and yardage. Heck, I believe with these limited options, Hartline and Bess would have had similar stats even if Henne had still been the teams QB in 2012.

As I have stated numerous times. Tannehill may prove to be a very good NFL QB. I just want to see it on the field and not in the speculation of those who really have no idea at this time if he can become a top tier QB in the NFL or not. I too believe he has the arm, the smarts, and is enough of an athlete to take that next step into being a quality QB. Yet until I see it on a consistent basis, I will continue to have my doubts that he is the long term answer at the QB position for the Dolphins.

If you want to drink the "Tannehill is great", kool-aid after one very mediocre season, that is fine with me. I'll just hold off having my drink until I see how he does when he he no longer has the excuse that he is a rookie QB and he had a lousy offense around him. Hopefully I will be drinking from that kool-aid bowl once the 2013 season is over.