If it had an effect on each individual they would not have to have sneak votes. The public would want it done every 5 years. The revenue is really only felt by a few..
Read the study posted above. The economic impact is far overstated. I'm not suggesting that it's not nice to have the Super Bowl or that there is no benefit. There is. But the value versus the up front cost is not worth it.
You guys are literally *****ing about the worst stadium in the league with the worst atmoshere getting upgraded, and are seemingly not grateful..really freakin ridiculous. Why in the hell do you think mike dee or anyone else affiliated with his team tells you they have to change the dynamics inside the stadium, why the hell do you think he mentions that our field is farther away then any other, why the hell do you think he mentions that our upper bowl is the largest in the league, for the freakin hell of it..NO, he recognizes there is a fundamental problem in the building. To bad this fanbase is clueless about it..
DJ, you are completely wrong. I'm sorry, but we seem to be having different conversations here. I don't think anyone is against the upgrades in principle. I'm sure they will be great. What I'm against (I'm sure other people are too but I won't speak for them) is using public money to pay for these upgrades. If Ross thinks it's a fundamental problem and that if he makes the upgrades his revenue will icnrease then I'm all for it. If he has to charge more for the tickets then so be it, and I can make an informed decision of whether or not it's worth it to me. But this is not what's happening. Ross wants at least $200 million of public money, which will hit the public, not just tourists. And it's simply not worth it. While I'm sure the upgrades will be great, the stadium is working just fine for me. And I think the odds of us never getting another SB without the upgrades is slim, but even if we didn't, fine. The NFL needs us more than we need them. The ebach is not going anywhere. The sunshine is not going anywhere. We will not be hurting for tourists whether we get the Super Bowl 5 times over 20 years or not
Look....I live in Vermont. Chances are...Im gonna get to Sun Life...like maybe once in the next 5 years. But...of all the things I get taxed for....if my passion...my favorite team...the thing I follow daily gives me joy....if they get a kick *** stadium...tax me. Ill pay. I want a new stadium
The public support has to be half of what the costs are estimated at. The NFL will pony up to as much as the other half but I do believe it's a loan of sorts. The key to getting the NFL to pay is that the Dolphins, and every team has to pony up their part of revenue sharing. So it's a loan but kind of not a loan since they pay it every single season anyway.
I see no reason that any stadium should be built with tax dollars. Why should non-football fans be on the hook to pay for a stadium?
Heres a thought..... Since the players demand to be treated more like owners then how about thet help pay stadium expenses.
Far from the worst stadium in the league. San Diego and SF and Buffalo are the friggin pits of humanity stadiun wise
I guess they could all stop giving to the local charitable organizations then and put that money towards the stadium You guys do know the NFL kicks in loans to the owners once the local community kicks something in to build or renovate a stadium. Between NFL loan money, Rosses money and any money raised thru taxes the place could get a decent facelift. Do not know why everyone hates that stadium. No, its not new but its far from being the pits. Far from it.
I do not hate the stadium. I think its a poor investment of tax money and it is something the NFL should pay for themselves. This is nothing more then corporate welfare. no its not
The atmosphere seemed fine during the National Championship game, I wonder why that is. Oh right because a ****ing winner was playing in the stadium. When this team is good again the fans will come and home games will feel like home games. The team being **** for about a decade is the main issue here,
The city will make the money back, it's a wise investment, the stadium isn't attractive to anyone...Period.I'm happy we at least have some people in executive positions that have the wits to understand that changes need to be made, and they told you strait up why, if you choose not to connect the dots or not be able to see how these renovations can improve a nasty reputation of our building, and what that means big pic?, ok, I'm done arguing about it.
This isn't about who's got nicer screens and club seats..bringing rich stadium into this tells me were not on the same page.
I know that sucking is our worst enemy, but it's never been my case..and I'm not gonna keep reiterating my reasons why this city and these two programs would tremendously benefit from a correctly built stadium, why don't you ask mike dee what he's talking about.
Sorry DJ but your argument is wrong. This is a bad investment for the state to get involved in. They will invest more money then they see in future returns.
If they told you straight up then why do you admit to connecting the dots? The city will make the money back? I'd like to hear how because any loan will take decades to repay.
Well, I can assure you that if the government were to spend that exact same money on other things than a stadium... it certainly would not have an impact on each individual either...
That's the point. There are a few studies that have been done and it does not have that big of an impact. Spending that same money on something else assures us of a couple of things. That a contractor will feel the impact of it, as will the right commissioners. I don't mind them placing a hotel tax to get the stadium renovated. I just want the renovations to be done right. From the looks of it, they might have been able to ask for more, which to me, is whats needed. Enough to gut the entire inside and redo....
While the study suggests that the $500+ million estimates of economic impact are overstated, it is pretty clear that the economic impact is far greater than $30 million, especially $30 million spread out over 10 years.
Quick Note: This 3 million a yr is kind of a tax break and economic stimulus for the local economy. While we debate the figures on local revenue from large events and benefit to the city i believe the vote was unanimous because the job creation potential. Remember there are 1000's of people put to work by this and countless local company's benefiting from the renovation. Businesses get much needed work, hire more workers and its trickle down effects. (im sure there is wording that states that certain amount of money must be spent local, minorities etc.) These monies from increased business will help offset the loss of the 3 million a yr that could be use elsewhere by increasing state revenue. This 3 million is a stimulus to the local economy not some corporate handout , its small potatoes for the good it can do. JMO
Maybe, but you're also raising the bed tax which could conceivably hurt tourism, if it gets too expensive to stay in Miami-Dade, people may choose to stay in Broward or Palm Beach. And if you use the bed tax increase to fund the stadium then you can't use it for some other tourism boosting project that would not get private funds. And yes the $30 million (it could be as much as $90 million) is relatively small but the county doesn;t have $200 million and the bed taxes are a projection. The $200 million is needed now and comes through bonds that need to be paid back, which are likely to affect the general taxpayer at some point if the projections from the bed tax are short. The studies also suggest that having a big event like the Super Bowl isn't necessarily bringing tourist dollars that wouldn;t otherwise be there, aprticularly for a city like Miami. Having the Super Bowl is great, but the cost far outweighs the benefit.
The Dolphins already get a sales tax rebate that they used to reconfigure the stadium for baseball in the early 90's and general upkeep since. They want an additional rebate. I highly doubt thousands of people will be put to work on this project. This isn't building a stadium from scratch and I doubt more than a few hundred workers are needed. Also, this project is simply replacing other projects that could put people to work. We have roads/bridges, etc. that need repair. Is that not a better use of state money than refurbishing a stadium which is acceptable to everyone except DJ and the NFL? Lastly, whether the stadium is refurbished or not won't make any difference to local business in the long run. The vast majority of years the stadium will be used only for 10 Dolphins games, 5-6 Canes games, the Orange Bowl and the ocassional concert, the same stuff it hosts now. What we're doing is laying out hundreds of millions of dollars up front due solely to the fear that we might not be awarded a Super Bowl or NAtional Championship that we have not been denied yet at some indeterminate point in the future. I think that's a dumb reason to spend money
What does mike dee have to say or propose for y'all to understand that I have been on to something for a very long time, is what he's on the record for saying hurting my position on this matter or hurting yours? There are reasons why he wants to do what he proposing to do, because he knows that inside the building there are serious issues...
Not sure about details on the tax rebate for renovations but it did give birth to a lucrative and taxable new sports franchise to the area. Now on job creation im sure its well more than hundreds for the type of project entailed. We are talking small businesses that get increased sales because employees spend in the area, business that help or supply a product, the added economic benifit to property values because the renovations increase the stadiums stature and prestige which in turn draw bigger events. The list goes on. Now i havent seen the details and there gonna change as a deal is made but here are some numbers that have been put out: http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/01/15/3182935/miami-dolphins-sun-life-stadium.html Note that this also helps the university of miami as well. Now im not sure if Miami will be a new home for international soccer in america but its a plan and a vision that has a chance to succeed. Miami is one of the largest and diverse in cultures so its a good plan imo. BUt with the renovations worked in a fair deal will help the cause. I believe many are tainted by horror on past public works projects but this one is pretty good. Now im not positive but i believe there was talk about revenue sharing on the stadium if this deal approved also. Decent deals are decent deals this isnt Miami dolphins bending someone over imo. It's money that brings dividends its a investment. now is it a good one i believe yes. Cheers
How many times do people here have to beat it into your head that we understand it will HELP having the seats closer? I guarantee you that I've mentioned this LONG before you. By a wide margin even. But you seem to think backwards on this. The winning and having a good team is the ONLY way to kickstart the stadium atmosphere. Fans are not coming to more than a few games to see the renovations, or a new venue, if the team they're going to see stinks. Also: There is a lot more to doing these renovations than just the Dolphins. There is a lot of money for Ross to make if he can lure a soccer team here. The possiblities are endless for them to make millions when the Dolphins are not playing there. A stadium that's 25 years old is not nearly as attractive as a new one or newly renovation one. This is almost completely about them making MONEY!
Yes, Canes fans are a fickle bunch. Dolphins fans are no more bandwagon than almost every other NFL team though.
I don't see the soccer thing happening. S. Florida has already lost an MLS team and the stars are aligning for Orlando to have an MLS team by 2015 pending a soccer-specific stadium deal. I have direct knowledge that the stadium is happening in Orlando. Also MLS doesn't want their new teams playing in non-SS stadiums with rare exception, such as Seattle. Tampa is pushing to get added down the road as well so I just dont see it happening in the next decade for Miami. World cup matches and friendlies are a different story...
wins will not change the culture, more people will come because of it yes, but the disconnect will still be there, and the ramifications of that disconnect will help in its downfall.
