The Talent Surrounding Ryan Tannehill: Part II

I agree with GMJohnson that the QBR is a reflection of the passing game and not just the QB. I dont think its a good indicator of the QB when you are trying to determine why the teams passing game is not doing as well as you want. There are too many variables that are out of the control of the QB to say that a poor QBR is exclusive to poor QB play.

 

I think it is generally fair in that reguard. The QBs performance has the most influence on that number but its not exclusive to his performance it is in relationship to many variables. You can see evidence in it from game to game and season to season. QBR for any QB can be a fluid number varrying from game to game. Is that because the QB has good and bad games...... at times yes. It also because of defenses faced, supporting cast, penalties, OC designs, and even opposing offenses can factor into the plays it forces your offense to attempt to stay in a game, the running games sucess can factor into it as well..... see where I am coming from?

 

Shou I have an idea that might interest you since you like to break things down into stats:

Not sure if you ever heard of the ELO rating system but I have been toying with an idea to create a way to grade passing games and running games seperately vrs opposing defenses as a way to predict performances for FF. The idea is assighn a numeretical value between pass offense and pass defense then predict which team is more likely to win the battle. It is the same rating system they use in chess. It would be more accurate then just looking at the nfl ratings because it factors in strength of schedule vrs just raw data accumilated.

 

I wonder what Ryan's qbr would be if we added the extra yac the falcon receivers have, to Tannehills receivers stats.

 

Whats a joke to me is not acnowledging it is a combo of RT needs to progress and the cast needs to improve. Do you think any other team, an above 500 team, would swap their supprt cast for ours?

 

So do tell, how do you know they would not?

Does one have a hot line into all 32 GM's offices or is there some substance to your argument?

 

Theres only 15 teams above 500 right now

 

They may make offers as well, and that is the problem with a strawman argument, it sounds bold but life rarely works like this.

 

once again it is up to me to prove my point yet you can say anything and I should take it as fact riiiigghhhtttt

 

The receivers on this team need to be upgraded. Hartline is a number two. Bess is a slot. Numbers with ZERO context are useless.

 

Padre, still wanting the career backup that is Matt Moore.

 

Seriously how is me saying that teams wouldnt take our cast any diff than you saying they will? Because you said it?

Of course its my opinion. But so is yours.


but IMO get it MY OPINION if Wash woul like Hartline Bess and Marlon Moore and Rashard Mathews over Moss, Hankerson, Garcon then I would switch in a heart beat. bess and Hartlin for Julio Jones and Roddy white any day. adn if you say you wouldnt, you are lying IMO

 

I'll be relieved when we get some real WRs in here to play with Tannehill.

 

If it correlates with the "general consensus" then it's probably wrong b/c the general public doesn't know jack ****.

 

LMFAO, a diff QB like who? Superman?

Cause I've seen them with a handful (Penny-Henne-Thiggy-Moore-Tanne) of QB's now and they are the same, limited players they were when they came into the league. No worries, they will BOTH be fired before the start of next season.

 

Hartline and Bess are good players.. Neither would be considerably with another Qb. I see its the passive aggressive Tannehill bashers that are fueling this thread.

I love the flawed logic of

Henne struggled... Tannehill struggled therefore Tannehill must be like Henne.

 

It's just an exercise in thought paddy. He said above 500. So winning teams. I'm sure KC would kill for our QB right now, considering the mess they have. They have Bowe (about to walk) but their wr's are nothing to write home about. But back to this mental exercise. Which of these teams would trade for our cast:

Falcons, Broncos, Texas, Packers, Patriots, 49'ers, Ravens, Colts, Seahawks, Bears, Bengals, Vikings, Redskins, Cowboys, Giants.

Those are the above 500 teams. Which of them would trade, completely, for our starting QB, WR, TE and RB?

Going backwards, it's just as tough. Jets? Chargers? Bills? Browns? Titans? Raiders? Jaguars, Chiefs. Those are the teams I'd even think about comparing.

 

Perhaps when you don't have an agenda you'll have something that actually is meaningful. One of the most obvious examples of a bias crunching of numbers.

 

Neither one of them are "good players".

Good meaning, halfway between average and great. Or between, ball parking now, 7th and 12th best at their respective positions. Neither guy is even close.

When healthy, guys like Hakeem Nicks, Reggie Wayne, Julio Jones, Greg Jennings, Kenny Britt, Vincent Jackson, Steve Smith, Desean Jackson, Marques Colston are good WRs. Then you have great WRs like Fitz, Dre and Megatron. You have Mike Wallace, Antonio Brown, Dwayne Bowe, Jordy Nelson, Sidney Rice, Percy Harvin, Brandon Marshall, Roddy White, Santonio Holmes, Michael Crabtree, Victor Cruz, Pierre Garcon, Miles Austin, Jeremy Maclin, Wes Welker, etc.

Bess and Hartline aren't in the same zip code.

 

If we are just going to trade bold statements, heck, Bess and Hartline both should be in the pro bowl.

Had to make do with a wildly inaccurate rook Qb.

See how this works?

I saw Pennington lift Martin, Ginn, Fasano, Camarillo and Bess as a later in the yr Rook starter.

Saw Henne struggle and the same stuff said "oh, it's not Henne's it's the wr corps!"

At what point is it acknowledged that building an offense around a young Qb takes time? What is it about Dolphins fans to always demand a quick fix when such rarely works like that in the league.

Compare Green Bay to the Eagles, one team understands this, the other used to understand it and went the quick fix route and failed miserably, that is far more typical of how the league works.

 

And of course, through the magical power of your opinion, they would do just as well with Tannehill at qb?

We clearly need a #3 Wr and a seam Te, however, to follow ones line of thinking merely inserting those players would make Tannehill more successful and that is more than flawed, it is wishful thinking.

 

I believe he was referring the guys we added not Bess/Hartline.

I'm not 100% on that one.

And FN, you should know by now I rarely bother with what they say publicly.

 

That said, I'd still rather find a #1 then a #3.

 

wildly inacccurate.... Lol 58% isn't wildly inaccurate. Bess and Hartline are not pro bowl players. We need a number 1 wr and a seam te.

 

So if its all about the qb, then why did Atlanta move up for Julio Jones? Why did Cinni draft AJ Green with the 3rd overall pick?

 

Pads... let think for a moment...

In the NE game... if this is one of the reasons... more accurate throws would have given the Pats a few more TDs also... I am talking about TB here, just to be clear...

For those that were not at the game, it was very windy out there, the ball placement in that game was at least the same for TB as for Thill... Strangley no one has mentioned it...

It was at the time TB's worst QBR as well as his lowest YPA, of the year, in that game (currently still)... but of course TB has a few rings so no one really talked about how TB struggled in that game either...

but we will just beat up on a rookie that cannot hit his receiver in stride in that game...

 

He was at 48% December 11th, his play has improved and that is merely being totally objective on the subject.

His last 4 games:


44.8
51
78
52

Avg: 56.45, 60% is considered the standard for a starting Qb's accuracy.

Even MMoore was at 60% last season and I consider him an inaccurate Qb in terms of ball placement.

Hartline should get some pro bowl votes, he has had a good year.

 

Green was BPA and fit a need, Jones was a piece they thought would move them into SB contention.

This was with an intact OL, and a settled offense and Qb, if one looks at how the Falcons did things it all really started with Michael Turner's acquistion, not Gonzalez or even Jones.

 

Every Qb has an off game 'Nardo, I'm not saying otherwise, what I am saying and I've pointed this out all year is Tannehill is not as sharp as he needs to be moving forwards.

A part of it, imo, was Jake Long's poor play, another part is he is rather raw as a passer sometimes, hopefully that improves over time.

This is one of the reasons why the whole "..find a Wr!!!" stuff is offbase imo, Tannehill has to improve as well but some folks are not seeing it.

 

His accuracy will improve when the game slows down in his mind, his body has the quickness to get him into better situations throwing, and his oline become better pass protectors..

I think our protection has been a bit below average..

 

Heading into the season, would he say the same about Hartline now?

We cannot know, we'll have to wait to see if they resign him to see what they really think of his game.

In the NFL, I believe the $$$ never the public stuff.

 

I honestly think it improved when Jake went out in fact I think it really helped Incognito's play.

Garner/Incognitio/Martin is better than our previous lineup imo.

Wonder if Martin's better athleticism allowed Richie I to be able to concentrate more on his position and not have to look to his outside as often.

 

Do know Ireland loves trying to underpay players, for example letting Reggie B walk unless he takes a below market deal.

Just imo, they offer him less than Stevie Johnson is making in buffalo.