Philbin, Sherman Ready for Training Camp & Nuggets

Just finished watching all of the new interviews Ro, some really good stuff in there..

For once I don't think it's just talk when they talk about that yes they are changing the system to the west coast scheme, however, the west coast is so adaptable you can change and mold the system to fit your players individual abilities..I believe them, and it's a key component to successful coaching.

Yes sir, he made it a point to talk about the bodies, saying we need to be a team that takes care of their bodies, in the weight room, and on their own time..We can only hope this is just not fluff, but a real conscientious effort to educate the ignorant about how to get the professional body to perform at optimum levels.

Did you see that quick highlight of Pounce destroying that bill player, check it man,he pulled a Mike Oher like in the movie, he literally took the player out, engaged him in the field of play with perfect technique, took his *** to the sideline, kept driving him thru the out of bounds area, thru the players, then finished off this punk by driving him over the bench and pouncing him..It was a beautiful thing.

I loved the excitement Sam Madison showed about Daniel Thomas in the zone scheme, he mentioned that while watching practice he saw Thomas's ability to jump cut and press the hole..That's a big back right there, who I saw flash good talent in an NFL game as a rookie, and I know he has great feet with that size..I think we're gonna have a nice 1 2 3 punch.

 

Thanks for the break down bro. Can't wait till camp starts.

 

Stellar report. Thanks for the short review... can't watch the video at work :/

 

It sounds a lot like a Mike Shanahan/Gary Kubiak style offense, and will be pretty similar. It's a run-heavy WCO that heavily features zone blocking and a passing game that plays off of it, but there's still a fair amount of difference to where you can't call it the same scheme IMO. There are some differences that go contrary to what those offenses teach. Claiming we need "one-cut" backs, etc. and so on might be premature.

 

I like the review. There is so much I am excited about for this team. I am ready for the season to get the season started.

 

I think Richie Incognito would disagree. In his interview with Dan Sileo, Sileo asked zone or man. Incognito responded zone will be the bread and butter, but they'll still do some man and some other stuff every once in a while. He finished by saying he thinks they have the backs to do it, that between Reggie, Daniel Thomas, Steve Slaton and "the young kid from Miami"...they're one-cut runners. He made it pretty clear that one-cut runners are needed for the system.

Again, that's not me, that's Richie Incognito saying that.

 

Philbin looks like a mashed thumb. Hope he coaches like a God.

 

Then I'm probably wrong. At least in my mind, the "one cut" thing means you're talking about the Mike Shanahan, Alex Gibbs scheme, which people tend take as zone blocking as a whole, rather than just the teaching technique.

Mike Sherman's offense seems to violate a lot of those tenants. Orthodoxy would say you need two run plays- The inside and outside zone, don't worry about other plays. Like you said, Sherman has more, including a couple of man plays(they seem to throw a toss play out of I-formation and a short pull interior run out of single-back). Alex Gibbs would tell you don't run zone plays out of a straight I-formation, but that's a huge portion of what Sherman did at Texas A&M. Same with linemen, outside of rare athletic freaks you normally wouldn't touch guys much over 300lbs, Miami will almost certainly start two 325+ pound Guards.

 

I think Miller has more talent than Slaton, and Slaton is to similar in stature to Reggie and Lamar, if your thinking we keep 4,than I would think someone like Messam would bring a different skillset to the table..

 

Can't see Slaton making the team if he's not one of our primary returners (which would be somewhat scary).

 

Not so sure about that. They asked Richie Incognito to lose a lot of weight. I remember him talking about it on another interview a lot earlier in the off season. He was 324 lbs last season, but I doubt he's over 314 lbs this season. And John Jerry seems to be losing his battle for the starting job. I also thought I'd heard that Artis Hicks was asked to lose some weight. If you had accurate figures on where Hicks and Incognito are, I doubt they're 325. They're probably both 10+ lbs under that.

 

Messam recently tweeted that he finally graduated from rehabbing whatever his injury was (presumably knee, didn't end up being nearly as serious as speculated).

Steve Slaton could be a good back for us if he's put his fumbling problems to bed. But we'll see. I like Messam more than most, I think. I like Jonas Gray. I like Lamar Miller. I have no regard for Daniel Thomas. I respect what Reggie Bush showed last year as a pure runner that I honestly didn't think he had in him, but I also fear it was a one year deal and it sounds to me like these coaches are going to use him more back in the role he played in New Orleans as a receiving threat. Also I'm perplexed whenever I hear Richie Incognito or Omar Kelly describe Reggie as a "one cut" runner. I damn near burst out laughing every time I hear it.

 

That's the conflation I'm talking about. I think it's quite possible that Incognito is just doing the same thing everyone else and associating zone with one-cut. I mean, Barry Sanders was a zone running back, but he might be the most antithetical guy there was to being a "one cut" runner.

 

Barry was just Barry, he wasn't a zone guy or a man guy. Special usually transcends systems. That's why I always argue that Zach Thomas was truly special and deserving of Hall of Fame status, because forever he was supposed to be a system guy that was protected by Jimmy Johnson's 4-3 Over system with the two space-eating defensive tackles up front...but then Miami moves to Nick Saban's hybrid system in which Zach was supposed to struggle, and Zach puts together arguably the finest two-year stretch of his career.

If someone wants to say that Reggie is that kind of transcendant player then all the power to them, not sure I'd agree...but he's not a one-cut system guy that's for sure.

 

That Texans game is one that I recently re-watched. I just wanted to remember what Daniel Thomas looked like when he was actually running well. Call me biased or whatever, I wasn't impressed. I watched the Texans game (where he did well, statistically) right next to the second Jets game (where he did poorly). It was remarkable how similar he was in both games. A lot of those big gains in the Texans game, holy hell you could drive a tanker through that eight lane highway. I'm thinking of one in particular...Thomas has this ridiculous lane right through the play's designed direction and he turns it up the field with nobody to say anything to him until he reaches the safety level. When he gets there, he just runs straight into the spot where both safeties were converging on him. Nothing. No cut, no wiggle, no juke, not even really any lowering the shoulder to try and get some extra yards after contact. Just popped like a bubble, with MAYBE 1 yard after contact. And it was like a 23 yard gain or something, too. It was like watching someone like J.J. Reddick try and execute a fast break with Lebron stalking him the whole time. No frills, no crossover, no using your body to block Lebron's angle to the ball, just lay the ball straight up to the basket and SSSSSSWWWWAAAT!

Offensive line really did a remarkable job in that game. Kudos. Even Colombo.

 

I think if Ray Lewis didn't exist there would be zero question about Zach Thomas Hall of Fame status. He was a 5 time All-Pro. Marino was only a 3 time.

 

Exactly. There was definitely a run where you had to say if Ray Lewis didn't exist, Zach Thomas is the most dominant middle linebacker in the game a la Mike Singletary.

 

I was waiting until I got through the thread before saying, Reggie Bush a one cut runner? Yeah, one cut, then another, then another.

 

Bold faced lie.

According to wiki it was 7

I love wikipedia but I always check its sources. At the top of his page it says he was elected to the probowl 8 times and lower it says 7 lol.

 

Well, you can only cut with one foot at a time.

 

And was that really a surprise? I still don't think he makes the final roster. Square peg...round hole.

 

He might be a special player, but you're still playing within a scheme. I'm sure he'd still be good in a more man-oriented blocking scheme, but you can **** up even a "special" player. The point is I don't think Sanders was really ever told to make one cut- Essentially it's not a universal zone blocking rule.

It's beyond the point and kinda anal retentitive, but he had a protective bubble of two space-eating linemen in front of him in both defenses, it's just going from Wannstedt's to Saban's he moved over a technique and was bracketed by a 350- and 300-pound guy instead of two 350-pound guys.

 

He's not really, though. He came into camp out of shape, which don't get me wrong is problematic, but he moves well for a guy his size. The coaching staff absolutely likes him. There's a reason why he started camp with the job, they've got high hopes for him. It's just a matter of him getting his head out of his *** in time.

 

JT said in the latest barry jackson sports buzz, that he would not put cameron wake in coverage because of his value as a rusher

 

So are cutting Bush.....or just trimming?

 

I didn't say it was. The surprise was that they seemed to be favoring him early on, giving him every opportunity, before it became apparent that Hicks would be the guy. I'm less patient than a coach. I'd be prone to skipping steps when I already know how it's going to end.

Thought John Jerry was a decent pick in the 3rd round, too. It's a shame. Never controlled his weight, never controlled his work ethic. I'd call it a potential Paul Soliai situation where any year now he could suddenly find his work ethic, but when they've put Jerry on the field I haven't been very compelled by his game play...unlike with Soliai.

 

Consensus seems to be that Jonas Gray will start the year on the PUP list and then Miami will have until Week 9 to get him on the field practicing, and if they do they'll have until Week 12 to get him on the active roster. By that time, injuries could easily clear the way for him. My concern is that they rush him back, make him a training camp participant which takes away any possibility of starting the year on the PUP list, and then suddenly they're faced with having to keep or cut him at the start of the year like you said. That would be dumb, but not wholly out of Jeff Ireland's range as a GM.

 

Because Jeff Ireland picked him in the 3rd round and they wanted to give him a valid opportunity before shelving him permanently.

 

Pass rushers typically say that.

 

Sherman's O had a variety of things in the running game and (IMO) his backs weren't able to really be a whole lot of 'one-cut' running style because the interior OL was not so good. But when it comes to that stuff, it's important because you can't afford negative plays. A lot of the one cut stuff in zone is more based off instincts, which guys like Bush and Slaton struggle with. Thomas is not patient enough. Lamar Miller is the ideal fit IMO.

Re: Incognito - I'm guessing we see more pin and pull blocking with him more than anything. Gives Pouncey the ability to constantly get in space and is most effective that way IMO.

On a sidenote, I think I quoted the wrong post of yours (meant the subsequent one I think). Apologies.

 

*goes to rebut*

*too late* ;p

Exactly what I was going to say. Last gasp effort to see if they could salvage him before cutting.

I'm not out to hate the guy, but his size and lack of development pretty much said it all. Especially for a coaching staff that likes their guys around 310-315lbs. I would have loved it had he developed because that would have been one hell of a beast to have at RG. However, you just can't trust Jerry to put it together especially with a rookie likely to be next to him.

 

IMO his best hope would have been RT.

 

Well stated. What about Miller's running did you like best for the style? For me, and I know that physical speed is not a necessity for the style, but it's the fact that he has the speed and burst in his back pocket to use when he needs it, which gives him the luxury of slowing the play down and using his eyes to see what he needs to see before he hits the button.