Well, I've thought about this a bit, and is this best FA Qb class since FA began? That's not hyperbole, iirc there have been only 3 good Qb who switched teams via FA and even made the playoffs or won playoff games -Kurt Warner in 07 or so -Drew Bress in 06 -Rich Gannon in the late 90's Too early to say on Ryan Fitzpatrick This yr Smith, Young, Garrard, maybe Orton, heck you could even toss Henne in there. Usually FA for Qb's means Brad Gradkowski's types. Any potetential FA Qb's whose names peak your interest?
I don't see how any of those guys you listed are all that different from "Gradkowski" types...except for more opportunity...
Well griddles, to me I like to have all of the options examined, Draft, Internally, Free Agency. Objectively speaking, this many Qb's who have had success hitting FA at the same time rarely happens so it should be looked at in the cold, objective, light of who they will be, and if they would make since for us.
Those QBs you mention will make fine backups. Nothing more. Good NFL franchises recognize the importance of the QB position. QBs you can win with as your starter do not hit the free agent market anymore except in the very rare occasion where a team has 2 very good QBs on their roster. We could see this if the Colts do indeed draft Andrew Luck... Peyton Manning in a Phins uniform? Now that I wouldn't mind seeing.
So what? They can't get on the field now..and were both "selected" when all the other QBs said "no thanks" to playing.
Not neccessarily, a couple had just worn out their welcome, take Garrard for example, he had a bad back and they had drafted Gabbert, at 9 million per yr it made little sense to keep him. Can toss Jason Campbell's name in their as well, injured, Raiders pushed in heavily for Palmer, makes no sense to keep him.
Good point on Garrard...but a bulging disc..yikes he might be done. The other guys just don't give me the warm fuzzies. I'd just assume keep Henne around in a backup role than sign Campbell, but I know that would probably never happen.
Smith, Young, Garrard, Orton, do not represent an upgrade to Henne Young will always be intriguing .... if you really want to talk FA QBs - the real steal would be Brees ... we are developing a very nice stable of options for any QB .... fix the line, a healthy Thomas, a real 2d option at RB, and i think a 2d year under Daboll would be pretty good for whomever our QB is.
Disagree, to my mind a FA Qb is kind of like used car shopping, you are there because you are not happy with your old car, ie, Henne. I think we will need another Wr and hope to see CClay develop at Te, and the point behind this thread is much depends on the coach we bring in, for example when Harbaugh went to SF, he passed on Gabbert and stuck with Smith to the surprise of everyone. A new HC may want to go with a Vet Qb, so why not look at the options on the market? Imvho there are good options this yr, far better then what is normally on the market.
You're reaching Padre. Smith is intriguing because he is playing fairly well, but I see 49ers resigning him. Young, Garrard and Orton and Henne? We've had the debate over VY over and over, we just agree to disagree there. Garrard is retired and has serious enough back issues that he's not playing anymore Orton showed his extreme mediocrity this year like I thought he would. He's only marginally, at best, better than Henne. IMO, this FA class is no different than any other mediocre QB class. and you forgot to mention Joe Montana in your original post. He went to Kansas City and carried them to the AFC championship. Brett Favre switched teams and had a couple of very good seasons. Randall Cunningham had that great season in Minnesota. Brad Johnson went to Washington (pro-bowl) and then went to Tampa and won a superbowl.
Garrard and Campbell are QBs that you can call serviceable, but they'll never win games for you without an outstanding running game. You can't put a team on their shoulders. And neither will ever win a superbowl as a starter. I know, I shouldn't say ever, but I'd bet an awful lot of money on it. Why on earth would you want to settle for QBs like this? If you want 10 more years of mediocrity or flat out awful seasons, choosing to pick our starting QB out of this crop of average to awful FA options is the exact way to do it. I don't mind you mentioning FA QBs as a back up, or stop gap if whatever QB we draft in the first round isn't NFL ready. But to suggest we try to find a starting QB among this FA group is lunacy, in my very humble opinion and shows a complete lack of understanding of just why we've been so bad the past dozen years. Especially post 2005. You can't consistently win without a very good or great QB. The best way to find the next great QB is to draft one. And every other team in the NFL knows this so you have to draft one early. Edited to add: If Matt Moore can continue to play like he has the past 2 games, I'm not sure any of these FA options would make a better back up or stop gap than him.
I don't see any of those guys being a major upgrade over Moore. I'd rather have a young Qb we draft with a ton of potential than to recycle any of these guys. I doubt seriously that Alex Smith is going anywhere after this season he'd be the only one that I think would be an upgrade and he's still hit or miss every Sunday. Vince Young is garbage at this point and Garrard is as well.
Here is the thing MB, and I doubt people realize they are doing this: How, do you, or anyone else, be they guru or newb member, "know" what a new HC is going to do? How do you "know" we will draft a Qb at all? Isn't that a fallacy of projection? "You" want it, so of course, a new Head Coach will want the same thing.
This list of QB's makes me want to wretch. If we are seriously spending another off season discussing the relative merits of Kyle Orton I will start following English Premier League soccer. There is only one FA qB that makes any sense, and that's Brees. IF the Saints and Brees continue their stare down, and Brees ends up witht he tage, I would at least explore making him an offer and giving up the 2 first rounders if NO didn't match. This is particularly true if we end up in the 6th or 7th pick range rather than 2 or 3.
I know what the owner wants, a franchise QB. And that is either a first round pick or Brees/Manning or some trade that might be out there that we don't know about yet. It does not include Kyle Orton and david Garrard
Padre, normally agree with you, but this sounds like the worst FA QB class.. BTW, while the Bills were actually winning a few games they signed Harvard boy to a long term contract, so scratch him off your list. Garrard is sooooo 2007..... And if Young and Orton represent the best FA class, then we are either headed for strike season in 2012 with Young and Orton leaving the union as scabs, or I live in some sort of parallel universe
While you were typing your post I edited in that exact statement into my post. If he can keep it up, we would have 0 reason to add any of these re-treads. Matt Moore, while clearly not an elite QB, is proving he is great back up material. And if whoever we draft isn't ready to play, we could probably count on him to fill the gap. I should also mention I think with all the rules favoring the passing game it's getting much easier for rookie QBs to make the transition from college to the NFL game.
Hasslebeck was a dolphin instead of a seahawk if we call his agent back. He went to a superbowl. Montana was a trade.
None of these "soon to be FA QB's" are starting material in my mind. Backups, sure, thats about it. We need to draft someone, first round, even if it means trading up to do so. We need to find our guy, develop our guy, and go from there. No more of this picking up other teams trash. Sure there's a risk in taking a QB in the draft, but Id rather take that risk and dare becoming great with a young QB full of potential than one of these been there, done that kind of guys who are serviceable, and nothing more.
I don't know for sure what a coach of more likely, the general manager will do. Is it possible we don't draft a QB? Sure. In my opinion, that would be an epic mistake. Look at the superbowl winning QBs since 2005. Now look at how many teams spent first round picks on those QBs. You get the idea. Question for you Padre: Do you honestly think one of these FA QBs would be better than drafting one of the top prospects in the upcoming draft? If so, which one? And why do you think that's the way to go? Which one of these QBs do you think can turn their career around and start playing at a level capable of winning a championship in today's NFL? Which of these guys do you see lining up as QB opposite an Aaron Rodgers led team and being able to win?
Exactly Bro, and keep in mind if folks get their wish and a "Savior" type HC is brought in, they will have the keys to the franchise, if they go with a Vet Qb..there will be no questioning doing so by the .Org. The SB is the byproduct of successful seasons though MB, cannot have one without the other, meaning you need a Qb good enough to get you to the dance in the first place. Honestly? I really do not know, meaning while many would like to believe the Qb is the be all end all, it wouldn't surprise me if a new HC thought we needed something else like a Wr or a OLB or what have you as they do not wish to hold a newb Qb's hand while they learn their job, which is not unheard of in the NFL. And keep in mind MB, the only advantage a drafted Qb has is there is no level of performance that they can be downgraded for, once they get in the league the whole winning thing is harder then it looks. As for whch FA Qb's interest me, atm, Young, Orton and Henne.
If we bring in a HC and/or GM who thinks one of those guys is the answer at QB, in my opinion we will have hired the wrong guy and then I'll have to seriously question whether or not I can continue watching Miami Dolphin football.
I'd much rather go into next season with say Moore and Barkley than watching Moore and Garrard duke it out in training camp for our starting job. At least Moore can caretake and backup, I honestly don't even want Young as a backup at this point. We need to invest in Qb talent. I wouldn't complain at all if we draft 2 Qbs to be honest, we need young talent at the Qb position with upside, not retreads and backups.
And the thing you are not "getting" is...they wouldn't care what you do. This is a part of the fallacy "if they do that, I'm outta here!!" They'd be like "so, whose monsterblitz and what does he have to do with the way I run my team"? Now, keep in mind, those are just my names,. I do not speak for a new HC, heck for example if Cowher is hired, and imo he's done coaching, he may very well trade for Dennis Dixon, and he would not care what you, I, or TD Dolphin had to say about it.
Padre, You're way out of line. I never suggested I had any kind of input into the Quarterback decisions of this team. Why are you even mentioning that aside from belittling my opinion? Also, you apparently have no idea of what fallacy means.
You misunderstand, it could be any fan's name in the reply, Coaches or GM's really do not care what the fans think, they are concerned with winning and disregard any view that is not inside the organization on achieving that goal. One example, Alex Smith was hated in SF, literally, if the fans had their way he would have been run out of town on a rail, iirc billboards were purchased to say how much he was disliked, Harbaugh did not give half a damn about all of that, and made him "his guy", the outcome is unimportant to the discussion the thought process..is, SFL or any of that has as much effect on Coaches as waving a beach towel at a jetliner passing overhead at 35,000 feet. I have an excellent concept of exactly what it means and applied it.
Alex Smith is still the SF starting QB, not by choice from Harbaugh, but by force. They drafted a QB in the 2nd round this past draft. Alex Smith was Harbaughs best shot at not embarrassing himself in his first season. Even if it was the mediocre Alex Smith everybody knows.
So you make a thread about free agent QBs, and state your opinions on them. When I or anyone else gives our opinion on QBs, you state that it doesn't matter because the teams don't care? Of course they don't. They don't care about your opinion either. So what's your point? No, not really. You stated - Me or anyone else saying, "If they do that, I'll stop watching" is not a fallacy. You can argue it's irrational, but it's not a fallacy.
Obviously. But I meant the mediocre QB Smith has been his entire career. Obviously he is playing better then mediocre so far this season.
I can't believe I'm saying this, but after reading this thread I'd rather talk about the draft some more.
Unless some unexpected QB becomes a FA, I don't see anybody on that list that is a franchise QB or even an upgrade to Henne. At best I see QBs who could be okay in the right situation. I don't see any reason to label this FA QB class as anything but ordinary.
None of those names turn me on, rather draft a franchise QB and let them learn under Matt Moore, who has shown he's a VERY good backup.
