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How can we get a spark on offense....

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by vt_dolfan, Nov 7, 2010.

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  1. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Somehow, some way...something needs to change on offense. Ive never seen a team that is so full of spastic, tempo less play in a long time. At times...we look amazing. But we never, ever build on that.

    1) Id like well thought out answers to this question. Please don't just say Henne sux, Henning sux, you know the drill.

    In some ways...I think Chad Pennington may be that spark....he does bring a certain confidence to the huddle...and I think he makes very quick decisions. Hes had half a season to let his arm get healthy....and I think sitting Henne next week just might do him some good.

    Maybe there is no spark to be had...and...this is..what it is.

    Something...SOMETHING is not working on the offensive side of the ball. Maybe its not a bad time to part ways with Henning. Maybe that brings something....not sure of any case history of what happens to teams when they remove an OC mid season....
     
  2. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    Add Randy Mo .... oh wait nvm.

    Seriously though, at this point it doesn't really matter.

    Firing Henning would be a good start though. Play action in obvious passing situations ... is just not good playcalling.
     
  3. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    OK...saying fire Henning feels good....but what are the ramifications of doing this? I dont see Sparano doing it though...because he will always come back to it not being done right on the field...

    And to a degree he is correct....the perfect throw by Henne to Ronnie Brown that would have been a first down.

    I just get the feeling...that our offense, isnt matching the type of players we have on the field. But we keep trying to put a square peg in a round hole...
     
  4. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    You want a spark? How about someone who knows how to call something other than playaction? Honestly, Henning is terrible - I have been banging that drum since last year. The man has an unparalleled ability to do the worst things at the worst times. Maybe its not all him, I don't know how much is Sparano, and frankly that worries me. But at this point, its time to try a new direction on offense, and I do not think the answer is Noodle arm or Thigpen.

    Putting a square peg in a round hole is Henning's gameplan. I swear to god the guy thinks of the worst call and goes with that under the thinking of "they will NEVER suspect that" while madly cackling to himself as the play dies a horrible death.
     
  5. Jaj

    Jaj Registered

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    The play action thing is almost bizarre. It pretty much negates any chance of a slant, it's just some bizarre *** stuff but the funny thing is I don't remember Pennington ever doing play action in obvious passing situations.

    Henne needs Kyle Rudolph. He needs a scat-back by the name of Leon Washington. The defense needs a new strong safety.
     
  6. BlameItOnTheHenne

    BlameItOnTheHenne Taking a poop

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    I'm watching the Eagles-Colts game and I'm imagining having a Desean Jackson type WR here. That would be a start. :wink2:
     
  7. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    Putting in Pennington or Thigpen. Or better yet, just cutting Henne outright.



    I'd really fire Henning if I could though (much like SF did with their OC).
     
    Miguel likes this.
  8. Destroyer

    Destroyer There for every play.

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    Run the ball when it's working.
     
  9. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=-

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    Argument killer.
     
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  10. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Yeh,

    Really....Im beginning to not see any downside by firing Henning. We have a guy who can step right in in Coach Lee. At least through the end of the season. And..it might just be a spark....and change in how plays are called.

    We just have 0 confidence. 0.

    Its 4-4....and I think we need a hail mary at this point to salvage this season. I dont think Miami can afford to play it safe.
     
  11. bluehaze

    bluehaze New Member

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    It's not Henne bro, He does make some WTF plays but that's to be expected from a rookie QB. I think it's alot more to do with the coaches. They all just seem half hearted out there which to me says they don't believe in their coaches and personally I don't believe in their coaches either...

    Not saying Henne is the answer, I don't know but I do know a QB can only do so much with a bunch of half hearted players out there on the field.
     
  12. Finsanity

    Finsanity New Member

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    a New OC with new offensive philosophy. Running game and effective screen pass/pass to RB keep defenses open for the long ball. IE Brady/Manning.
     
  13. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    Because I referenced SF?
     
  14. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Does anyone really see any downside to making a change from Henning at this point?
     
  15. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    It's not all Henne (and I want him to start for the rest of the season for the record), but he needs to cut down on mistakes (just like WRs need to ****ing not fall down and need to hang on to passes) like the one at the goal line.
     
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  16. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    Not if the plays remain essentially the same (not the play calling obviously).

    I don't think Henning is even a bad OC. But if we wanted a spark, that might be a place to look, as there is only so much you can do halfway through the year.
     
  17. Shamboubou

    Shamboubou Well-Known Member

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    Sorry but we have too much talent on this offense from top to bottom to be as bad as we are on offense.

    Part of the problem that most people dont see is that if we changed our offense to a deeper passing or some other kind of offense I'm not sure we have the right players at WR. I think Hartline and Bess are good WR's because of the offense we are running with them in it. The quick little shifty routes that get you 5-10 yards. I'm just not sure they are the same talent at WR in a different offensive scheme.
     
  18. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    the playcalling is not the problem. its the execution game in and game out. we have way too many critical mistakes on crucial drives. today 1) henne overthrows fasano for an easy td we settle for fg/ ronnie brown drops a 3rd down pass/ henne throws a pick that hartline fell down on but in all likelihood is picked anyway, etc..

    we have to learn how to make those plays. the plays are there for the taking but our players are messing up
     
  19. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    I don't know that it's a catch, but I definitely don't think it's picked if he doesn't go to the ground.
     
  20. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Spark on offense? Bench Henne and put in Pennington. Next fire Dan Henning and let
    Pennington call his own plays. I have no doubt that Pennington would be more creative in his play calling and the offense would score more then one TD a game.
     
  21. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    db had a hell of a break on thgat ball. hartline might have broken it up if he doesnt slip but the db was going to be the first one to the ball. he just read henne's eyes on that one
     
  22. Miguel

    Miguel The smartest Man on earth

    BRING BACK TED GINN AT LEAST WE BEAT THE JETS WITH HIM... :p
     
  23. rdhstlr23

    rdhstlr23 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think it's a little bit of the playcalling and the players especially the QB. Think how much different this game is if we get 7, rather than 3 before the half and we are up by 1?

    The playcalling was fine. The execution was not. That was a great PA pass at the goaline, but a poor pass. The only issue I had with the playcalling was us going away from the runs and taking Ronnie out. I type Ronnie and I just think of that dropped pass...
     
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  24. Jaj

    Jaj Registered

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    Pennington was meant for this system though, Henne isn't. Henne is a young slightly more mobile Drew Bledsoe that kind of guy. If your QB isn't explosive and mobile. At least have guys on the field that are.

    I would put money that if you took all of the Dolphins' top skill position players, they be the slowest group in the NFL.
     
  25. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The wildcat offense should of never been scraped, it should of been evolved...

    You have a player in Ronnie brown who noone can really argue, has a skillset that excell's out of the formation...To take that away from your starting running back is not using the parts you have to the best of their abilitie's.

    He took something the offense did well....Worst offense in the league..

    If we know he's gone next year, I would give him next week's game against the titans, and see what happens there, if we dont win, make the switch.
     
  26. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    It almost feels like...

    Our coaching staff has a "dont lose mentality" when it comes to the offense. I think the offense has taken that identity. Sparano and Henning preach...dont make mistakes....dont turn the ball over....win time of possesion. But they dont preach the need to attack....to destroy the defense that lines up across the field. We have NO SWAGGER. And..we havent really had that for a long, long time. We have no killer mentality....

    At this point...I think the play it safe mentality is HURTING THE TEAM...more than helping. Its Henne's head IMO. The one pass to Davone Bess...when he was open...Henne waited just a tad to long before throwing it IMO.

    They have got to just cut it lose....and live with the occasional turnover, and I actually think we will see LESS as a result over the long haul.
     
  27. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yes, because he's really not nearly as bad as people pretend, and a lot of what is execution, or bad quarterback decision making gets put on his shoulders.

    That, and there's a lot of people here who have their own offensive philosophy, that they've developed playing Madden '11 and watching Chris Berman highlight reels.
     
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  28. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    It kinda perplexes me as to why we havent tried the wild cat with Thigpen...it really does.
     
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  29. PerfectTeam

    PerfectTeam Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Same problem on offense this year that we had on defense last year. There is no speed out there. Look at what Ray Rice did us all day. That kind of speed and athleticism is missing from our offense. Depending on the CBA, there are going to be some interesting options in free agency for us. Mike Sims-Walker, Marcedes Lewis would like nice in a Fins uniform.
     
  30. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Eh...I dont agree Gusti...Im not looking for Madden play calling...not at all. But, Hennings weakness in my opinion, is.....HE CANT DANCE!!!

    And by that I mean...he has no sense of rhythm. He makes great play calls at times...and then hiccups and kills it. He calls PA passes....when we have all but abandoned the run....and NO BODY IN THE NFL BITES AT OUR PA PASS.

    Its not so much his playcalling....its his attitude. Its a Id rather take 15 plays to score. Our offense IMO is a perfect reflection of the OC.

    Makes the great play....can make the great play....then just for what ever reason....sputters and chokes. You cant deny the great plays are there....just as you cant deny Henning makes the occasional brilliant play call...WE PLAY LIKE A CRAZY OLD MAD SCIENTIST.
     
  31. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Thats because our running game isn't very good. But you don't abandon the running game, nor do you abandon play action.

    Well first of all, if you don't think running long, time-consuming, demoralizing drives are an appropriate football strategy, you're wrong and I'd ultimately have to lump you in with the Madden people.

    But that's not what they are doing. They're throwing the ball 35 friggin times a game. Not execution isn't conservative.
     
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  32. frozenfin

    frozenfin Well-Known Member

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    3rd down conversions in the 3rd quarter were hard to come by. Incompletions and sacks on 3rd and a couple. Dropped passes.

    3 running plays in the 2nd half.

    The momentum clearly shifted immediately after halftime. We don't defer on the coin toss to go 3 and out on our 2nd half possession.

    It looked to me like John Jerry had some total whiffs and missed assignments in the 2nd half that stuffed Ricky's run and allowed a sack.

    A spark...

    GO DEEP! Hartline and Marshall have shown the ability to make plays deep down the field. Are they Desean Jackson? No of course not. But come on, take some shots! And receivers, when the ball is thrown your way, ummm you need to catch it! Brown, Fasano, Marshall... if the ball hits you in the hands, you should catch it. Period.

    DON'T ABANDON THE RUN! The last rushing play called was with 8:22 left in the 3rd quarter only down 20-10. I groan just as loudly as anyone else when we run the ball or Henne runs play action when we're down by several scores late in the game or in 2 minute drives. But... to not hand the ball off once in the last 22 minutes of the game when Ronnie was doing well in the first half, that's disgusting.

    We stopped running the ball, we don't go deep... so we're counting on near-perfection from Henne and the short-mid range pass attack. With our receivers getting another case of stone hands. Against the Ravens defense. It doesn't work. More pressure was put onto the defense, who couldn't stop Ray Rice.

    That drive at the end of the 2nd half was a heck of a spark, I can't remember a 2 minute drive from the Dolphins looking that sharp in a very long time. But it ended, once again, oh so close to 7 instead of 3. Then we went 3 & out at the start of 2nd half, punted, and let Ray Rice run down the middle of our defense. That's where the game was lost and where the offense needed to spark, take the lead, and keep Ray Rice off the field.
     
  33. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Long...time consuming drives all the time...is not a good football strategy. Every new snap increased the chance of a bad play....you cannot count on a team to do that consistently. And...you can still be very conservative throwing the ball.

    That being said...NO DOUBT you are correct about lock of execution. Horrible pass by Henne to miss Fasano. Dropped passes by Brown...dropped INT's by Sean Smith....

    But...if its the lack of execution.....

    I gotta say......

    I keep hearing that from Sparano and Et all since we have had them here.....and we still DO THE SAME THING.....

    Why can this team NOT EXECUTE consistently.

    We give ourselves NO MARGIN for error. None...and its not like we dont execute ever. We do over 80% of the time...but when you build a team that has to execute much better then that....

    Im just not seeing where this team is gonna get over this last 10% of the hill....we have a really good team...but we CANNOT GET OVER THE HUMP...and I cant figure out why.
     
  34. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    I have another question...

    Can anyone remember the last time the Phins under this staff...have had a game where the offense,defense, and ST's were all firing on all cylinders?

    Im beginning to wonder if this staff is really good at getting us to be a good football team, but will not be able to turn us into a great football team.
     
  35. mroz

    mroz Fix the OL Club Member

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    When was the last time the Fins executed a screen pass correctly? We can't for several reasons. First our OL is not very good in the open field. Those plays go no where if not properly sold and blocked. We have no speed at any of the skill positions which prevents us from having success if one element of the screen play breaks down.

    We are just to damn slow.
     
  36. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    Get Henning the hell out of here. He has no clue what a slant is. He watches his RB dominate the 1st drive of the game, then abandons him the rest if the way. He has no clue what throwing deep is. We went deep twice all game, one was completion, the other was a pathetic no call on what should have been a PI. He calls 2-3 bubble screens a game which gets 1-2 yards maximum. His RB screens are terrible. Have run maybe 4-5 successful RB screens in his 3 seasons here. He uses playactions on 3rd and long.

    Last but not least, his philosophy is a joke. Playing not to lose, loses. He's ruining Henne's development by teaching him to be conservative, and not to make mistakes. Turning a gunslinger into a game manager. Take no chances... Take no chances, don't expect very many wins.
     
  37. Califin

    Califin Well-Known Member

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    Being out here in Cali, I've never had the perspective of seeing them in practice.
    But I'm curious if old man Henning actually gets out there on the practice field, with the offense, to instruct and scrutinize the players as they implement the plays, or does he stay in the office, and basically have assistants out there directing the on field execution?
     
  38. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=-

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    Spark this offense? We could get in a time machine kick Dan Henning's dad in the jewels really hard.
     
  39. Finsanity

    Finsanity New Member

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    The Fasano TD pass had 50% chance of being completed. That was tough throw to complete. Wide open but the path to completion was very difficult.
     
  40. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I dunno what to tell you other than you are wrong. It's basic, fundamental football, and has been for a very, very long time. It's not sexy, Deion Sanders isn't going to come up with some whacky phrase on the NFL Network highlights, and it isn't going to get ESPN great ratings, but all that is hype, pure and simple.
     
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