Ah hell he was 26... Transitioned real well You keep Taylor and Porter. Anderson and Moses Should have traded Joey when the value was up... Everyone thinks Crowder will show up. My rant......
I think it ALL comes down to $-worth play. Exactly how effective has Roth been with Cleveland? Clem Chowder SUCKS, and I doubt we ever see him play another down in Miami.
And at some point he will be injured again with that groin. He's got a chronic groin injury that plagued him every year he was here. Not to mention he was lying about the injury...pretty much admitted it in an article in the offseason out in Cleveland.
And yet we continue to keep Crowder who is always hurt and lies with his play on the field so your point holds no water. Roth is a force in the Browns defense now and could still be here. Cutting Roth was one of the few beefs I have with this regime along with keeping Crowder.
At that point in both their careers, Crowder had done a lot more than Roth. Roth had a few DECENT games at the end of 2008 while Crowder doubled him statistically while starting one less game. I think you should have beef with Roth, not the Dolphins. He had yet to do anything in the league and wanted a huge pay raise. He was holding the Dolphins hostage trying to get a new contract. One that he had yet to earn. I've seen this front office reward players for their play more than a few times so my guess is if Roth had kept his mouth shut, played, and played well, he would have been in negotiations at the midway point of 2009 for a nice raise.
He's just not a Parcells guy. Simply put. Unfortunately, well, thankfully not anymore.... it was a requirement to be classified as one.
Roth had five sacks in 2008 and transitioned from DE to OLB in one offseason. He was great at setting the edge against the run. He was only 26 at the time and well worth keeping. Not having Roth around really hurt the defense last season IMO and we should have kept him. It was a glaring mistake by the FO. BTW Crowder has 2-1/2 sacks in six seasons Matt Roth has 18 in the same time span. I know they don't play the same position so it is a difficult comparison but Roth makes bigger plays than Crowder. He is a tougher football guy who makes the defense better. Crowder doesn't do that. We cut the wrong guy.
I know this regime didn't draft him if that is what you mean. If not please explain to me exactly what you mean by that..... He did everything they asked him to do.
Crowder absolutely makes this defense better. He is an excellent complimentary player, just like Roth, except Roth had only been that for a half a season with Miami. Five sacks as a starting OLB in a 3/4 defense is not impressive at all. He had the other side of him being double teamed constantly. What was impressive about Roth was that as the year went on, he improved, and for his first season at OLB (as you mentioned), he showed promise. By no means did he earn a big pay raise, which is what he wanted. His career to date was average at best. And he is the one who tried handcuffing this team for more money. The team did not do anything but want to see him play during the preseason and his mysterious injury (cough B cough S), um I mean, his want for a new contract got him cut. I would have liked for them to have kept him but I like the way they did not take his crap.
LOL except play when he was asked to.... After this regime took him from being a barely average DE in the 4/3 and switched him to the promising OLB in the 3/4, he desides it's in his best interest to sit out and ask for big money.
He was a Parcells guy actually. Not by draft but by measurements. He fits right into what he likes as an OLB.
Well, he is good at chasing the play down from behind...usually WAY behind...... like 15 yards behind.....
Seems to me, you have selevtive reading. Read wth i said after that and if you cannot agree with it, you simply hate him as a player. Who would you rather have on defense right now.....Dobbins, or Crowder? Hmmm
When he is the best Lber on his team, thats true. But when he is the complimentary Lb, he is good and you see far less of those type plays.
Kp you miss the whole point. Yes Roth was an up and coming promising young player. But he did not earn a pay raise just yet given the scenarios Ozzy laid out for you. He was threatned by the presence of Jason Taylor playing essentially the same position as he in our 3-4 and felt he needed to hold out to pressure the regime to sign him to a new contract as a way of assuring both job security and money in case he gets hurt. He was insisting that he had been battling a nagging groin injury but it did not prevent him from playing the year before. The injury supposedly carried over into camp so he held out, even when medical reports came back negative. He subsequently never played another down for us. Good riddance, when you hold out and lie about an injury, its a stupid way to compete and endure in the business world of the NFL. He's not exactly lighting it up in Cleveland, but he works well as a complimentary player in a 3/4 and probably would have more impact as a DE in a 4/3(his natural position) IMO. But anyways, ya, you wanted us to keep this moron?
And on Crowder, how well has our defense looked since he's been injured going back to last year? Yea, get back to me on that.
Nope, I dont agree at all. Clem Chowder SUCKS I don't care if he is the primary, secondary or tertiary ILB. He is NOT a good ILB.
ill take karlos dansbys word over our fans that hate crowder. a blind bat could see how much our defense dropped off without him last season. He was flying around and making tackle for loss in the preseason before the injury and yes crowder is not the best.....but he is lightyears better than the crap combination of dobbins/barbie
And got absolutely TORCHED by every RB and TE in the passing game. He is what he is... a mediocre ILB.
with dansby, we wont be asking him to cover as much.....crowder is who he is.....he takes on the fullback as dansby cleans up. he stays home as dansby covers the tight end/half back. thats the plan all along with the dansby addition. thats why he will be better in the secondary ILB role
He's no a coverage LB..He is a banger. We have Dansby now to be our coverage guy. Problem was Ayodele was even worse as our coverage ILB so Crowder tried to pick up the slack. Crowder's best at helping out in run support and short yardage passing. Dansby is the guy who's now covering RBs and TEs.
and FTR i hate we cut roth.....atleast give us an explanation....how come roth hasnt said anything? maybe when we play the browns....we might get an answer we've been waiting for
Well, you can't always be right. I am one who always said lets upgrade the middle once Crowder was the main Lber. He is average at best in that role but with someone like Zach and Dansby next to him, he does not have to think for anyone but himself. He simply has to play his role, and he is servicable in that role. Slightly above average.
How about why did we cut Ted Ginn? He is making plays on special teams for the 49ers. Not like Miami needs help in that area or anything. He was expendable. It's all about saving dollars.
As do I. IMO, as I've said before, this was an ego reaction by the staff. Instead of mitigating the situation they decided to cut his nuts off attempting to send a message. Stupid and wrong guy to make that stand against as Roth was always a full 100% effort player. It's not like he was pulling Haynesworth type diva crap. They made the team weaker because of ego. As for Crowder....... I don't get the people that are taking the extreme stances. Crowder dosen't suck nor is he a top LB. He is a decent player that definitely will make the D better once he gets back though. When you go from a consistent, steady player to backup talent of course it's a big hit. A starter dosen't have to be an All Pro for a team to miss him.
I agree with that as well. You cannot tell me that this team would not be better simply from his Kickoff return ability AND his ability to stretch the field deep. We have neither of those threats. It was tougher with Ginn than Roth though I would think because of the money involved as he was a 1st round pick. As happy as I've been with some of the personnel and draft moves this staff has made, they've made some moves that left me really scratching my head and wondering WTF as well.
I agree. Ted Ginn has made more plays on special teams against the Eagles than the dolphins returners have in 4 games. I would rather have Ginn than Moore.
Anyone else see Ginn run his team into a 15 yard illegal block penalty? Its **** like that which got him cut.
I don't understand how anyone has any questions about the Roth scenario. The guy forced his way out. There's a degree of mystery, but we know for a fact he was A). Unhappy with his contract here B). Lied about an injury, either about having it or the nature of it. C). Half-assed it when he returned from injury and got himself cut due to it. D). Demanded a trade from the Browns because he was unhappy with his contract there this offseason. He's a malcontent. He was a nice role-player when he was here, but he very much forced himself out like he's tried to do in Cleveland. Why anyone is taking his side against the coaching staff here is absolutely beyond me.
When you cut back across the field three times, running back a good 10 yards, you're asking for things like that to happen.
People have gone kind of overboard with the Crowder hate, on the other hand. He's got coverage and lateral mobility limitations, but the guy has been pretty damn good in between the tackles or coming downhill. He was a pretty good 2-down thumper when Zach was here up until 2008, he had an excellent year that year, and a bad year in 2009. It's really hard to say he sucks from that, especially when we don't know why he fell off the face of the earth last year like he did. I think with Dansby here, he's clearly in a position more suited towards his ability.
