Did any you think that Davone Bess would have to change his role. I personally think it would enhance the role he has already as a slot receiver. Anyway here is the link: http://www.thephinsider.com/2010/5/12/1468377/dont-expect-the-role-of-davone#storyjump
His roll wont change but his output will probably increase because teams will have to make changes to compensate for BM. Depending on what opposing teams have to do to cover Marshall it could give Bess more space to work in and more chances.
He needs to stop turning the ball over and has NO BUISNESS returning punts...but he is a solid slot guy for us.
I know it sounds crazy, but Bess is almost expendable now that we have Marshall, being our primary chain mover for intermediate/possession plays. The lack of a true speed receiver to further stretch the field is going to somewhat hinder the potential explosiveness of our passing game. Ginn would've been intriguing to see opposite Marshall. Now we'll never know. I like Bess but I expect his production to take a dip with Marshall eating into a big chunk of the 3rd down work he got last season.
wow i don't see it that way at all. i think the third down role remains the same even with marshall on the field this just opens up more opportunities to get open bess is a possession guy and a damn good one. No way he is expendable especially if we are seeing more three WR sets that is where bess gets more involved and his role could marginally increase
Yea, I know. The thing is, Marshall is a more physical, bigger Welker, too. Welker works so well in New England because he's got a guy with 4.2 speed lifting defenders upfield. Marshall isn't slow by any means, but he's not Moss type fast, either. Marshall and Moss are too totally different receivers. Marshall works the middle of the field, looking for contact, whereas Moss likes to stay close to the numbers and get upfield. Ginn would've done a better job than anyone we have now of drawing a safety or 2 away from the middle of the field (even if he can't catch). Hartline is quick, so he might work out. At least I hope....
Let me put it this way. On 3rd and 5+, who do you think Henne is more likely to look to, to convert, Bess or Marshall? QB's love bigger targets. Especially guys who are as sure handed and talented as marshall. He has a knack for getting open and making plays in crucial moments. The guy has had 100+ receptions the last 3 seasons for a reason. I just can't see how Bess' 3rd down receptions don't take a dip with Marshall on board now.
Bess is getting better and is Welker-esque already. Having an obvious #1 target like Marshall, only creates more space for a guy who needs very little to make a play. I love Bess and he's the reason we didn't draft a pass catching TE IMO. He should continue to grow/develop. Going to be up to Henne to take what's given to him and produce. No excuses for him this year.
Last I heard, converting 3rd downs to 1sts was fairly important. Bess was as good as anyone in the NFL at that. The idea that someone so reliable is expendable is outrageously laughable. Furthermore..unless a clear upgrade is available, why would we want to get rid of Bess or Camarillo? I don't think you trade away someone just for the sake of trading. And the way it stands now we actually have a group of WRs that AREN'T mediocre or bad. When was the last time Dolphin fans could say that? As to the actual topic. Yeah, I think the 3rd down role pretty much remains the same regardless of who we added. There are still going to be times when we're 3rd and 9 and we know Bess can get us the 1st down. Like you I'm hoping we see more 3 (and maybe some 4) WR sets
I don't think Moss is actually a 4.2 guy anymore...just sayin As to Ginn....I'm not too sure he would scare anyone this year. I'm pretty sure that DC all know if you get physical with Ginn at the line and pop him hard the first time he makes a catch, then you've pretty much taken him out of the game.
Moss can still outrun 9 out of 10 DB's in the league. I don't know where he's clocked at now, but his speed is still more than sufficient at lifting opposing defenses. While what you say about Ginn may be true, I don't think any coordinator would be dumb enough to let him run down field uncovered, is my point. Ginn was not a #1 and we never saw him play along side a legit #1 that would take the pressure off. You can't teach speed, and just the threat of that alone would make things easier for all of our receivers as a whole. And I'm not saying we should literally get rid of Bess, I just think what he did for us last year cannot be expected to the same degree this year when we have Marshall who will be running those same kinds of routes. We have a surplus of possession-type receivers now, with no true deep threat. Somebody's got to run a route beyond 10 yards for us. Marshall will be an all-purpose receiver, for sure, but he's at his best in the middle of the field, creating YAC (just like Bess). I fully expect to see Marshall utilized like he was in this game (not to the same degree, of course), all next season for us: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSxTV9Ol-Xk&feature=related"]YouTube- Brandon Marshall NFL RECORD (Most receptions in a game - 21)[/ame] ^That's essentially the same type of routes Bess ran for us last year. We're not going to be throwing the ball enough for Bess and Marshall both to maintain similar stats as they did last season, respectively. My money is on Sparano and Henning focusing more on getting the guy they just paid 50+ mil to the ball where he's most comfortable. Not to mention, it isn't hard to conceive a 6'4, 230 pound target being more attractive to QB to throw to on 3rd down than anyone else. Just sayin'
Well I guess you can attach whatever label to Brian Hartline that you want. But he did avg 16.3 ypc last year. To me that says he's more than your average possession guy. 16.3 ypc is comparable to any of the WRs who carry the "downfield threat" tag. It's higher than Moss's 15.2 from last year. Higher than Reggie Wayne's 12.6, too. So I just don't see the problem that you see.
I think Brian Harline is a downfleld threat. Sure he is not Ted Ginn fast and his 40 time doesn't show him to be fast but he is fast. How is it that almost every time he catches a pass, he flies past a defender for a big gain or for a touchdown? Maybe it's me but that seems like speed to me. He has good route running skills so that may make up for his "lack of speed".
It wasn't my intent to peg Hartline as strictly a possession-type. I was speaking specifically of Marshall, Bess and Camarillo, as all of them are most skilled in ball-control routes, and (in Bess and Camarillo's case) can't be anything more than that. The jury is still out on who will be starting opposite Marshall opening tip between Hartline and Camarillo. I hope Hartline impresses enough to win the spot, as I feel he has the skillset to better compliment Marshall. And while he had an impressive ypc average, you're definately skewing the numbers by trying to compare a rookie with 31 catches on the year to two bonafide all-world receivers with 83 and 100 catches, respectively. I seriously doubt he'd be able to sustain that average given the same amount of targets as Wayne or Moss. Realistically speaking, he can be that guy who stretches the field for us, but to assume he'll be that is premature, IMO.
Who can predict production, but Bess's role will stay the same. He'll just have a helluva lot better blocking for him with Marshall and Hartline on those swing passes in the flat.
Does anyone honestly expect Davone Bess' production to increase this coming season? 76 catches for 758 yards, in a run first offense where he will be the #3 option, doesn't exactly bode well for him to improve on those numbers. I think he will still be equally as effective in his role, but with Marshall poised to be the main target and a safe bet for 80+ catches, and Hartline looking to pull in 50-60 balls I just don't know that the opportunity will be there for him to increase his numbers from last year. And because he's small and can get lost in the middle of the field I don't see him exactly being a red zone threat to make a significant improvement on the 2 TDs. Don't take this to be bashing on Bess. I love Bess and he is amazing at what he does. I just don't think he will really have the opportunities to improve on his numbers that drastically.
I think he'll continue to be our slot receiver. He really isn't suited to play any other role. He's not the greatest PR or KR either, but he'll likely play a role there anyway, unless RGM or someone else stand up, we traded away our best returner. The thing is, he really isn't fast enough to be your #2 WR. His best role is the same role that Marshall will occupy as a guy that lines up in different locations depending on the coverage, but Marshall is far superior in that role than Bess ever will be. His problem is speed. He's just too slow. While he's shifty, he does tend to go down at first contact, particularly on PRs. He does, however, know how to get open and find the soft spots of the D, he's simply not very good at YAC. We are banking all the picks and money spent on Marshall on Hartline being able to produce on the opposite side of him. I think that it'll work, but Hartline still has some 'growing' to do. As for returner, I'm currently at a loss until we see what some of the UDFAs can do, like RGM, Pruitt, etc...
I wasn't expecting his role to change anyway. He's a slot wide receiver and that's it. I'm not keen on seeing him returning punts or kickoffs for us so hopefully we find a better solution before the season starts. Bess is a great asset in the role he plays but put him anywhere else and will be lacking in comparison.