I know it's still very, very early. But I think it's a good time to get discussion going about what our team may look like going into next season. Below is my opinion as well as some brief reasoning behind my thinking. I welcome all input and constructive conversation here. QB (3) Chad Henne Pat White Chad Pennington I believe that we will find a way to trade Tyler Thigpen before the start of the season. RB (5) Ronnie Brown Ricky Williams Patrick Cobbs Kory Sheets Lou Polite I see Lex Hilliard being cut. He just couldn't do it last season when it counted. I could see Tristan Davis landing on the practice squad WR (5) Brandon Marshall Brian Hartline Davone Bess Patrick Turner Ryan Grice-Mullen This is by far the hardest group to project, with LB being the lone possible exception. The front office seems to be high on Grice-Mullen. He does bring something special to the field with his return ability. I don't think he'll take Bess' place, nor do I think this coaching staff is going to give up on Patrick Turner so easily. That being said I think Camarillo will be out of a job. And I"ll for one be sad to see him go. Out of Marlon Moore, Roberto Wallace and Julius Pruitt I could see 2 of them landing on the PS. TE (3) Anthony Fasano Kory Sperry Joey Haynos John Nalbone was unproductive last season and found himself waived in October. The 6'8 Haynos will beat him out. As for the question of carrying 2 or 3 TEs, this offense has a tendency to run 2 TE sets so having 3 available is almost a necessity. OL (8) Jake Grove Jake Long Vernon Carey Richie Incognito Donald Thomas John Jerry Nate Garner Joe Berger I believe that Justin Smiley is on his way out the door. I liked him a lot. But I think his time is done. Nate Garner makes the team simply for the Carolina game last year where he played 4 different position on the Offensive Line in one game. The wild card here, does Donald Thomas get cut if he can't get healthy? DE (5) Phillip Merling Kendall Langford Jared Odrick Lionel Dotson Tony McDaniel I believe Tony McDaniel will move over from DT which is now a crowded position and be the 5th DE. Alama-Francis has a shot at the 5th DE spot. If he doesn't get on the field this season I doubt he ever will. I think IAF has an edge over Ryan Baker and Brian Johnston for the 5th spot DT (3) Randy Starks Paul Soliai Jason Ferguson Travis Ivey is clearly the odd man out in this group LB (9) Karlos Dansby Cameron Wake Koa Misi Tim Dobbins A.J. Edds Chris McCoy Channing Crowder Quentin Moses Charlie Anderson I believe that Torbor will be cut and I also believe J.D. Folsom and Austin Spitler will end up on the practice squad. The wild card here is Crowder. Crowder still has value to this team but it will diminish rapidly with the influx of new LBs. Could the team use this uncapped year to dump the bloated salary they gave him last offseason? CB (5) Vontae Davis Sean Smith Will Allen Jason Allen Nolan Carrol I've heard rumors that Jason Allen may move over to safety. Or that Will Allen might take FS. But Ireland said it's unlikely that will happen. So A.J. Wallace and Evan Oglesby seem like the odd men out here. I believe they have a specific plan in mind for Nolan Carrol. S (4) Yeremiah Bell Chris Clemons Tyrone Culver Reshad Jones Pretty simple here. Nate Bess will be the odd man out. The wild card here is Darren Sharper/Atogwe which could push Culver off the roster. K (1) Dan Carpenter P (1) Brandon Fields LS (1) John Denny And that's the way I see the 53 man roster. I would love to hear everyone's input on it.
Bravo. This is great and it's the perfect time of year to start kicking this stuff around. I'm on my phone right now so I'll give you my thoughts on your roster when I get home. Great stuff, Trowa. What does "trowa" come from anyways?
I actually got it from an anime called Gundam Wing several, several years ago. It's an anime about giant robots (called Gundams) and outer space battles between the Gundams. It gets really political as well. Anyway, Trowa Barton was my favorite pilot from the series. So I've been using Trowa as my handle on message boards for a really long time now. I also just find the name Trowa to be particularly bad *** in and of itself. I dunno why. I just do.
Nice job bro. The shake up could become at RB. There are a lot of questions to this group. Ricky is getting older, but can still play. Ronnie can't stay healthy back to back seasons and was made available this year for a 1st round tender. Is he in the team picture in the future? A lot will depend how good that Cobbs coming back from injury, Hilliard, and Sheets do in camp. If they have doubt about Ronnie in the future you could see a youth movement here as well. Only time will tell.
I agree with you in principle about Pat White. But lets look at a couple of facts. Chad Henne is the starter, there's no doubt about it. Pat White is going to make the team. They wont give up on him after one season. He's talented. Chad Pennington, despite having clauses in his contract which escalate his pay scale exponentially if he plays more than X plays next season, I do believe makes the final roster. I don't see them giving him a new contract only to terminate it before the start of the season. So, while I personally feel that Thigpen is the 2nd best QB on our roster currently, I don't think he will be here by the start of the season. We wont carry 4 QBs. The roster is already going to be very tight so I don't see being able to keep Pat White on as anything but a QB. So our best hope, as I see it, is to pray we can move Thigpen for something substantial before the start of the season. And if we can't, then what do we do then? We'll have to see how it goes though.
Nice post, but I tend to agree with JS concerning White v Thigpen as well as Camarillo's place on the roster. I have nothing as far as what to do with White. However, I would hope after last year, coaches would feel more secure with Thigpen at #2 than White. Likewise with Camarillo. The guy was our most reliable WR last year - and this while still recovering from an ACL injury. They brought him along slowly similar to Brown the year before. IMO Thigpen and Camarillo are two guys you bring back. They're both back ups, true. But they're also two of the most reliable back ups on the roster. We've learned the hard way you've got to have reliable depth if you hope to compete. I realize it's folly to give up on a player after only one season, so I would be surprised if either White or Turner were actually moved. To be honest, Grice-Mullen has a bigger chance of being the odd man out. I also believe Ryan Baker may stick.
My thoughts: ** Hilliard over Sheets seems like an obvious choice but I could be wrong. ** I like UDFA AJ Wallace from Penn State as the fifth DB, possibly making the team over Jason Allen. He can also return kicks and has great size/speed for a DB. ** I think Thigpen will not be moved and will make the team over Pat White, who will be cut. ** Camarillo should stick over Grice Mullen.
Camarillo started every game last year. He started every game in 2008 before he was injured. His snaps for 2008 and 2009 combined are the most of any WR on the team. He had the most total starts both seasons combined, of any WR on the team. That doesn't sound like a backup. He may become one in the future, but I'd like to think someone will need to beat him out in a legtimate competition first.
If White stays, he'll be the #2 only so they can get him in the WC stuff. The only real hope for White is that he suddenly develops into something other than a weak 3rd string QB. That said, he'll stay only because he is this regimes' high pick. I question them dumping Cammy, except by trade before TC starts. The thing is, personally, and I may be in the minority here, but given my druthers I'd take Cammy over Bess any day. Bess is versatile and a good route runner but rather slow. He's inconsistent in the return game as well. His biggest issue is that he seems to go down with the first guy to touch him moreso than the other WRs/return guys we have. I like what Sheets can do, but given that Cobbs, our regular 3rd down guy was out some of last season, wouldn't we have seen more of him than we did ?? They mostly chose to use Hilliard more and moved Bess around a lot. That doesn't bode well for him coming into this season. If RGMs return game is as good as predicted they could be faced with a tough situation...
2010 possible 53 Man Roster: QB (3) 1) Chad Henne 2) Tyler Thigpen 3) Chad Pennington Pat White will have to find another job description, SpecialTeams, ScatBack WR, Slot , whatever or move on. RB (5) 4) Ronnie Brown 5) Ricky Williams 6) Patrick Cobbs 7) Rolly Lambada or Pat White over Kory Sheets 8) Lou Polite WR (5) 9) Brandon Marshall 10) Brian Hartline 11) Davone Bess 12) Greg Camarillo or Pat White over Patrick Turner 13) Ryan Grice-Mullen Patrick Turner will muscle up in the preseason & attempt to convert to TE TE (3) 14) Anthony Fasano 15) the Mix: Kory Sperry or the return of Martin/entrance of Pat Turner @ TE, or Lyndon Murtha @ H-Back/TE 16) Joey Haynos OL (9) 17) Jake Grove 18) Jake Long 19)Vernon Carey 20) Richie Incognito 21) Dimitri Tsoumpas 22) John Jerry replaces Donald Thomas as the project? 23) Nate Garner 24) Joe Berger 25) Lyndon Murtha DE (5) 26) Phillip Merling 27)Kendall Langford 28) Jared Odrick 29) Tony McDaniel 30) Lionel Dotson DT (3) 31) Randy Starks 32) Paul Soliai 33)Jason Ferguson LB (9) 34) Karlos Dansby 35) Cameron Wake 36) Koa Misi 37) Tim Dobbins 38) A.J. Edds 39) Chris McCoy 40) Channing Crowder 41) Quentin Moses 42) Charlie Anderson CB (5) 43) Vontae Davis 44) Sean Smith 45) Will Allen 46) Jason Allen 47) Nolan Carrol S (4) 48) Yeremiah Bell 48) Chris Clemons 49)Tyrone Culver 50) Reshad Jones look for the acquisition of a veteran FS, possibly Darren Sharper to change the equation K (1) 51) Dan Carpenter P (1) 52) Brandon Fields LS (1) 53) John Denny just a guess @ what the end roster may look like. there are always surprises once the pads go on & they start hitting. some possible changes to consider: acquisition of a veteran FS, return of a healthy Martin, the Pats have to find contributing, functional positions on the roster to stick. Competition is the Elixir of Success.
Don't know why but I feel like Cammy gets traded to KC. He could really help Cassel and we know Pioli well.
Friend Trowa, about Pat Turner: good size, football smart, excellent hands a RedZone threat, too much talent in the WR stable & not much of anything @ TE
Wow, cutting a 2nd round pick after only one year would tell me: 1) the front office really ducked up that draft 2) this front office is brave as hell being honest about their mistake and movig on. That's what job security from a good owner let's people do.
Pat White will have an opportunity to hack out a start/contribution somewhere on the roster because he is a second round choice
Not necessarily. He must bring something to the team. This year a roster spot will be huge accomplishment due to the talent.
QB (3) Chad Henne Pat White Chad Pennington / Tyler Thigpen Either Thigpen or CP will be traded during TC ... I still vote for CP. I have no vote of confidence for PW, but he may get 1 more year to develop before he gets purged. RB (5) Ronnie Brown Ricky Williams Lou Polite Patrick Cobbs / Kory Sheets / Tristan Davis Lex Hilliard Hilliard will have to show some improvement to stick ... but he will not be quick to go - since he may be needed next year. Cobbs appears to be a Coaching staff favorite, but Sheets / Davis could prove more valuable on STs ... it will come down to what they offer as a 3d down back. Brown like several other veterans 'could' become TC trades ... won't get a good idea until the OTAs. Lambala doesn't seem to have a chance ... WR (5) Brandon Marshall Brian Hartline CAM Davone Bess / Ryan Grice-Mullen Patrick Turner / Taurus Johnson / Julius Pruitt This and G are the 2 toughest positions to project with so many bodies, Marshall and Hartline are locks. Bess would seem to be next on the list ... but it will be interesting to see how much Mullen challenges him. Mullen can also make it as a STer with his 'quickness' and if he can show he can hold onto the ball. CAM is a known quantity - and just makes plays ... possibly not enough plays - but plays none-the-less. Turner has a lot to prove ... and he will go against Johnson and Pruitt. I expect to see at least 1, but possibly 2 of Moore or Wallace on the PS. TE (3) Anthony Fasano Joey Haynos John Nalbone I don't think the FO has lost faith in Nalbone, other roster moves forced them to move him to the PS last year ... he has had a year - so we'll see where he stands. I think he'll be ready to produce this year. Haynos is a solid blocker, and showed he could catch if needed. Sperry showed a nice spark as a pure pass catcher - but is not a blocker ... i think they will try another go around on the PS with him. OL (8) Jake Grove - C Jake Long - T Vernon Carey - T Richie Incognito - G John Jerry - G Nate Garner / Joe Berger - G/C Andrew Gardner / Lydon Murtha - T Donald Thomas / Andrew Hartline / Ray Feinga / Dimitri Tsoumpas - G I will be shocked to see Justin Smiley in MIA ... Nate Garner played well and showed some surprising versatility. G is still a question with Incognito and now Jerry added to the fold. On 'paper' we will place them as the starters ... but that is no guarantee with all the other Gs we brought in. I see only 1 of the flock of Gs making the roster (Thomas, Tsoumpas, Feings, Hartline) and 1 of Gardner / Murtha as the backup T. Murtha could get put on the PS -- as i still see solid potential from Gardner. Berger 'could' still be too valuable to let go ... maybe not with Garner .... the final OL roster is dependent upon the how the G position settles out. DE (5) Kendall Langford Jared Odrick Phillip Merling Tony McDaniel Lionel Dotson / Ryan Baker / Ikaika Alama-Francis This is make or break for Dotson, Baker and Francis; as i see only 1 making the cut .... especially since McDaniel offers versatility. Outstanding play 'could' make Merling available in a trade .... DT (3) Randy Starks Paul Soliai Jason Ferguson (won't count for 1st half ) Vince Oghobaase or Travis Ivey goes to the PS, one may make the roster - since Fergie won't be there for a bit. Additionally, with these 2 ... Soliai is on notice as well. The difference is that Soliai can play a penetrating NT ... not sure with the UDFAs ... LB (9) Karlos Dansby Cameron Wake Koa Misi Tim Dobbins A.J. Edds Channing Crowder Charlie Anderson Chris McCoy/Johnston/Walden Folsom/ Spitler This changeover will be telling .... can pretty much guarantee Misi and Edds are on the roster, along with Wake, Dansby and Dobbins ... I see only (1) of Johnston, Moses, Walden making the cut. Anderson will have a fight, but think he will stick - as he showed some value last year, and could be a backup on the WOLB side. J.D. Folsom or Austin Spitler will have to prove to be ST mavens to make the cut. I believe McCoy and Spitler will be on the PS. "Could' this be the end of Crowder in MIA ... possible, but not likely until next year (unless Dobbins or Edds plays lights out -- albeit, Edds needs a year to get stronger). The wildcard here remains that we don't have a 'sized' OLB to play SOLB ... at least none that jump out at you from Moses or Johnston ... so a FA is still in the realm of the possible .... and of course, there is the unkown in Wake and his progression from a 1 trick pony. CB (4) Vontae Davis Sean Smith Will Allen Nolan Carrol / Nate Ness / Jason Allen / Ross Weaver / AJ Wallace Is this the year Jason Allen meets the ax ... could be. STs will dictate whether he can be replaced or not. Expect at least 1 of Carrol / Weaver / Wallace to be placed on the PS. Will Allen 'could' get traded - but doubt it ... we want to have a veteran presence and make a playoff run this year. S (4) Yeremiah Bell Reshad Jones Tyrone Culver Chris Clemons ** still the chance to sign a veteran FA, which would mean the end for Bell/Culver or Clemons (Bell or Culver most likely) ... still believe Clemons has solid potential, and that Clemons / Jones are our future at S. K (1) Dan Carpenter P (1) Brandon Fields LS (1) John Denny ** we need to find a way to get away from this roster slot ...
Nice read but I like a couple shockers... Such as an extra receiver and a strong rookie LB class. Nobody ever gives Cam enough credit. He's too good to let go.
QB's (3) 7 - Chad Henne 16 - Tyler Thigpen 6 - Pat White RB's (5) 23 - Ronnie Brown 34 - Ricky Williams 38 - Patrick Cobbs 26 - Lex Hilliard 36 - Lou Polite WR's (5) 85 - Brandon Marshall 82 - Brian Hartline 15 - Davone Bess 83 - Greg Camarillo 84 - Patrick Turner TE's (3) 80 - Anthony Fasano 81 - Joey Haynos 88 - Kory Sperry OL (9) 77 - Jake Long 63 - Andrew Gardner 74 - John Jerry 64 - Jake Grove 67 - Joe Berger 68 - Richie Incognito 66 - Donald Thomas 72 - Vernon Carey 75 - Nate Garner DL (8) 70 - Kendall Langford 94 - Randy Starks 98 - Jared Odrick 78 - Tony McDaniel 71 - Lionel Dotson 95 - Jason Ferguson 96 - Paul Soliai 97 - Vince Oghobaase LB's (8) 55 - Koa Misi 58 - Karlos Dansby 52 - Channing Crowder 91 - Cameron Wake 54 - A.J. Edds 51 - Tim Dobbins 93 - Quentin Moses 50 - Erik Walden DB's (9) 21 - Vontae Davis 24 - Sean Smith 25 - Will Allen 32 - Jason Allen 28 - Nolan Carroll 37 - Yeremiah Bell 35 - Reshad Jones 29 - Tyrone Culver 30 - Chris Clemons ST's (3) 5 - Dan Carpenter 2 - Brandon Fields 92 - John Denney PS NT - Travis Ivey S - Jonathan Amaya WR - Roberto Wallace G - Dimitri Tsoumpas DT - Kyle Harrington CB - A.J. Wallace LB - Chris McCoy LB - Austin Spitler i think we'll trade Pennington and Merling. Smiley is probably going to get cut outright
Nice job. Not too many issues with the roster you posted. We obviously can't carry four QB's. I would rather carry Henne, Pennington and Thigpen, but I think we likely will deal Thigpen to a team that is looking for an experienced backup QB, but if not I would cut Pat White and just say we made mistake taking him in the 2nd round. I think Hilliard will make the team and Sheets will be out among Running Backs. I think Camarillo makes the roster over Grice-Mullens or anyone else as our #5 WR. Patrick Turner may be on the practice squad unless he can show he is ready. I also think Spitler will surprise and make it the LB spot over Anderson.
My sleeper to make this team is AJ Wallace. He has elite size/speed combo for a DB as well kickoff return ability. Additionally, he played consistently for a big time school in the Big Ten (at Penn State alongside Jared Odrick). Most importantly, Wallace plays a position of need for us at DB. At the very worst, I see Wallace competing with Nolan Carroll for the fifth and final DB spot. And If Jason Allen gets axed (as I suspect he will), Wallace is in excellent position to make the final 53. He did a good job covering some good WR's last season (Eric Decker comes to mind) so he has the ability - the light just needs to come on. Put differently, assuming that Wallace's return ability is equal to that of Grice Mullen's, Im guessing Parcells/Sparano would pick Wallace over RGM since theres a logjam at WR already while we are in short supply of DB's.
These are the "chalk" bets for this time of year. I do agree with a number of you that Gardner is likely to make the team as the only other true LT, though if Long can't answer the bell we would likely move Carey to the left side and put Garner in at RT. There are a couple of other tweaks such as not having to count Ferguson until the 9th game but otherwise these would be the betting favorites at this time of year. The idea of a trade of Camarillo to KC to give Pioli his Wes Welker is interesting and could happen. I would hope we would get something up high for him like the Welker deal which was for a 2 & 7 which we then wasted.
I'd love to see Roberto Wallace make it, he seems to have elite size and be a good target for Henne. I know it's pretty unlikely with the depth of WR at the moment but along with Marshall, the size at WR could be awesome.
I honestly believe they'll be releasing Pennington. I really cant see them letting Thigpen go for nothing, especially since teams are going to need a QB somewhere down the line this season or next off-season and Thigpen has shown glimpses of how good he can be. And well, Pat White is Pat White, very versatile and effective when used in certain packages.
1 Chad Henne 2 Chad Pennington 3 Tyler Thigpen 4 Pat White 5 Brandon Marshall 6 Brian Hartline 7 Davone Bess 8 Greg Camarillo 9 Patrick Turner? 10 Ronnie Brown 11 Ricky Williams 12 Patrick Cobbs 13 Lousaka Polite 14 Anthony Fasano 15 Joey Haynos 16 Kory Sperry 17 Jake Long 18 John Jerry 19 Jake Grove 20 Richie Incognito 21 Vernon Carey 22 Nate Garner 23 Joe Berger 24 Donald Thomas 25 Andrew Gardner 26 Randy Starks 27 Paul Soliai 28 Kendall Langford 29 Jared Odrick 30 Phillip Merling 31 Tony McDaniel 32 Lionel Dotson 33 Karlos Dansby 34 Channing Crowder 35 A.J. Edds 36 Tim Dobbins 37 Koa Misi 38 Cameron Wake 39 Charlie Anderson 40 Chris McCoy 41 Vontae Davis 42 Sean Smith 43 Will Allen 44 Nolan Carroll 45 Jason Allen 46 Yeremiah Bell 47 Reshad Jones 48 Tyrone Culver 49 Chris Clemons 50 Brandon Fields 51 Dan Carpenter 52 John Denney The 53rd spot will go to the best special teams player. Could be Lex Hilliard, Kory Sheets, Tristan Davis, Rolly Lumbala, Erik Walden, or Austin Spitler. QB - Here is the question. How many more years does Pennington have left? If the answer is one then I could see us keeping four quarterbacks this year. The other thing to consider is whether or not Pennington can return 100% healthy. His body has been through a lot. WR - Every year I hear people say we should trade Camarillo but I believe he is an extremely valuable backup. He could start if you needed him to. He can play special teams. He is clutch. How many #4 receivers can you say that about? That leaves one spot for Patrick Turner, Ryan Grice-Mullen, Julius Pruitt, Taurus Johnson, Marlon Moore, or Roberto Wallace. My money would be on Turner. RGM has a chance if he can make an impression as a return man but we are not carrying six receivers. RB - Brown and Cobbs return from injury. Polite is the best fullback in the league. Along with Ricky Williams they are the men to beat. We might carry a fifth running back but they would have to be a special teams standout. With the proliferation of the two-back system five running backs might become more common. TE - Fasano and Haynos are safe. For 2010 anyway. Nalbone will have to beat out Sperry if he wants to stick. I like Sperry. OL - Long, Jerry, Grove, Incognito, and Carey will start. Draft picks be damned I believe Nate Garner is our swing man. Berger is safe because he can play center. Thomas and Gardner are the likely developmental guys. However there is a lot of competition and Andrew Hartline, Lydon Murtha, Ray Feinga, or Dimitri Tsoumpas could surprise. NT - Starks is the man. Soliai is safe until Ferguson returns. Soliai better hope somebody gets hurt so he can find a home on the inactive list. Otherwise he might get cut mid-season. Keep an eye on Travis Ivey. He will make the practice squad. DE - Langford and Odrick will start. Merling, McDaniel, and Dotson will have to fight off Ikaika Alama-Francis and Ryan Baker. This will be a battle folks. May the best man win. OLB - Misi and Wake will replace Porter and Taylor. Wow. Now that is a ballsy move. I believe the real battle here is going to be between Charlie Anderson and Quentin Moses. I say Chris McCoy will stick because you cannot develop him if you put him on the practice squad and another team poaches him. He will be inactive every week but he will be on the 53 man roster. If Brian Johnston can stay healthy he is a darkhorse. He has a ton of potential. Time to live up to it. ILB - Dansby and Crowder will start. Edds will play in the nickel. Dobbins versus Torbor for the last spot. Spitler is the odd man out. He will have to be a demon on special teams to stick. He is a shoo-in for the practice squad if doesn't make the cut. Folsom is the next Dolphin to be cut. CB - Will Allen will try to win his starting job back from Vontae Davis or Sean Smith. This is will be one of the biggest battles at camp. Bring it on! Carroll is the heir apparent in the nickel. A.J. Wallace has an chance to stick as a return man. Jason Allen could be in trouble if Wallace takes one to the house in a preseason game. S - Bell will start. Culver is not really in contention for the free safety spot. He is Bell's backup. Clemons will have to beat out Jones if he wants the job. Fields and Carpenter are safe. Denney has been on our team forever. I think he has a Super Bowl ring from the 1972 championship. Shula's favorite player.