I just don't see us easily parting ways with Thigpen. Sure, if we can make some kind of trade that will make us better, then you always pull the trigger. But would someone really give us their second round pick for the guy? As for the Bills....I wonder what Gailey thinks of Brohm. But if they're looking at us for QB relief, trying to lure Pennington makes more sense since he's a FA. They would probably want to use him the same way we did. Draft a QB and start Pennington while he develops.
Why? A starting Qb is no small thing MM, a 3rd rd pick can just as easily be Pat Turner as Brandon Marshal, meanwhile we just gave away a starter for different team in our own division? Does the name Wes Welker ring any bells?
I like this idea Pads, although getting a second would be unlikely I would think...why not, it is all about draft picks anyway, and that defense needs alot of help so why not try to accumulate as many picks as possible u know?
Still don't understand how we traded a 5th for him - didn't play him all year - and now we expect to get a 2nd or 3rd for him? If a team was willing to get even a 4th for him they could have had him last year. Plus you have to imagine there are other options out there (Philly has McNabb AND Vick). I think we are overvaluing our assets here, guys.
The thing is bro, things change year to year, people leave, people retire, look at Ariz, they need a back up now....then if somebody gets hurts in the pre-season....things come and go, but yes I would agree a 2nd no way......but depending on how desperate teams are u know??.....Look at Oakland, if there ever is a time for J-Russ to go, guess what big fella..this is your year!!....they could use Thigpen...
All true finyank, but many teams view those situations as being what the draft is for. I think PhiNomina is right. Nothing (or, not enough) has happened to elevate Thigpen's value from a 5th to a 2nd round pick. I just don't see any real market for him. And, frankly...I think he has more value to us than anyone else. JMHO...
I can see that bro, but if your that high on him, as I think we all are, wouldn't another team want a young backup with starter experience as opposed of drafting somebody who your not sure can ball....and also what if something happens after the draft happens....football is wierd like that sometimes, just when you least expect it boom!! you need something desperately....I agree no way 2-3rd rounder, but I won't say no way to a 4th....I'd take it...this OF COURSE is ONLY if Penny stays, if he doesnt, keep Thiggy
I don't know. I kind of enjoy seeing Buffalo suffer without a QB since it gives us two great shots at wins each year. It's a tough question. Most would tell you the right answer is that a third or better and you do the deal. Turn that third around and nab Anquan Boldin. For a fourth it's really not a great upgrade from the fifth we spent. For a second obviously but that won't happen. For a trade up in the first round and a fifth I'd consider that as well since it would make McClain or Berry possible. I'm going to go check out Buffalo forums.
To me it all boils down to how good the Coaching staff and F.O. thinks Thigpen is. They have had almost a year to evaluate him. If they feel he can be a quality starter in this league then you have to place that value on him. So ask yourselves what do you think a quality starter is worth and assign him that price. What we gave for him at this point in time is meaningless. Here is a simple example. If you find something at a garage sale and by it for one dollar and then have it appraised for a thousand dollars would you take two dollars for it simply because you doubled what you paid? If you answered yes please go to the back of the line. I think Thiggy is starter material, But I'm not a member of the F.O. or the coaching staff. I base this off of his career stats which are on par with Chad's. If it was me I simply don't trade him unless someone is willing to overpay. Let us never forget how hard the search for a quality starting QB is. To me the perfect scenario is we bring back Penny to both backup and help tutor the young QB's. Move White to WR, or find someone willing to give us a pick for him. That leaves us with three good QB's. Trading Thiggy alone leaves us one hit from having to start Pat White and franky that scares the piss out of me.
exactly....don't buy a house in 05 and try to make profit on it now.....Miami got lucky with him, they bought low in my opinion...they could sell for a 4th...I'd fight for a 3rd, but I'll gladly take a 4th, quality depth still in the 4th round, ask Boomer.....
It's nice to have a three deep quarterback rotation that can really help you over the course of the season. On the other hand I'm looking at Buffalo's team needs and the one that pops out consistently is their need for a tackle. Bulaga and a few others should more than be available a little lower, but won't be in the second. A pick swap and a third is the price I'd ask for Thigpen. I might be satisfied with a fourth and a fifth plus the pick swap.
The chance that Thigpen turns out to be a succesful long-term starter is about as high as a number of other players. Joey Porter+Thigpen for a third plus fifth.
What I'm trying to say Is he's worth at the very least a 2nd and that's outside the division. Just think back on how many draft picks we have given up searching for a QB? how many of them were second round picks. Now ask yourself how many of them were better than Thiggy "appears" to be? Please guy's don't be in such a hurry to get rid of a young QB that has shown his kind of skills. If all we can get for him is a 3rd this year keep him. Develop him. His stock will only rise.
what options does Buffalo have besides spending a 1st rounder on a guy that ehhh really isnt a clear cut 1st rounder.....??
You wont develop him if he doesn't play.....which barring an injury to Henne (knock on wood) he wont.....dude I will drive Thiggy to the team he is traded to for a 3rd.....
i think pat white is the most mishandled situation this coaching staff has gotten into. And i DON'T mean drafting him in the first place. They clearly never expected Pennington to get hurt when they drafted White. White was supposed to be used sporadically throughout the season but as soon as Pennington went down the coaching staff had to use him as something more. But they didn't have time to treat him like a real qb so they just kept moving along. It's okay to hate the White pick as many people here do. But he was never treated as a real QB until after Pennington went down. As for that steelers game? Pat White looked like a raw rookie qb. no doubt there. He looked like a guy whose never stood inthe pocket in the face of pressure. (because he hasn't) But that should change with time and experience. And that's really the only thing Thigpen has on White IMO. I say trade Thigpen if we can and laugh at the Bills for another silly move. Thigpen is not a playoff winning QB. At best he's a hard working and creative QB, but not someone whose going to win games consistently. (he is 1-10 as a starting qb after all. And I blame him for the steelers loss. Our defense gave him the ball in field goal range and because of him we didn't even get a field goal. That's classic A.J. Feeley stuff)
That would give him a better winning percentage than White has completion percentage. I don't think Pat White will ever develop into as good a quarterback as Thigpen is right now.
Ok lets say the above scenario works out. We sign Penny and move White either Via trade or to WR whatever it doesn't matter. Thiggy is now our 3rd string QB. He then becomes our WC QB. He has got all the skills to excel at the Cat. Value goes up. Also I have to point out that a QB simply riding the Pine for another team doesn't decrease their value. If you look and compare his career stats they are good. His skill set remains the same but he has another year of development under his belt. Teams trade for other teams backups all the time. Value goes up or stays the same. Seriously though we spent a second round pick the last two years and now we are considering letting go a QB who is better than White and who's career stats are equal to Henne's go for less than what we paid for either of the above. So now Thiggy is gone. None of us think White is a true QB so what are we going to do now draft another QB? Sign a FA that other teams could have for free? if you chose the later consider if other teams could have the FA for free and are still willing to trade for Thiggy then have we just traded down. As already stated please don't be in such a hurry to get rid of a good young QB.
you're entitled to that opinion and you might be right. But all we've seen from white are 2 pass attempts. We haven't even seen him get to play QB for real.
Well actually he had 5 attempts and his next completion will be his first. Is that reason alone to give up on the guy? no. Is it reason to assume he's going to be a quality NFL QB? again no. At the very least Thiggy's 11 starts show he has the skills to start in the NFL.
I've never thought that he would be a good NFL quarterback even when he was coming out of college. This year certainly didn't change my mind.
It's pretty clear what Gailey is going to do with that offense. He doesn't care who his QB is. He's going to put Lynch in the backfield, find a receiving TE, use 3 WRs and have Vick/Thigpen whatever mobile QBs he can find simply force teams (like us) to play a spy, five defensive backs, and then see what we can get out of a basic rush formation. Our defensive counter as of now to that spread formation is the same one that got *****-slapped by the Colts. Our defense is left with three CBs, a FS in deep coverage, the SS on the TE, and the more athletic LB on the RB. Up front that leaves you with the spy being the less athletic LB, the TED (Ayodele) and a four man rush that's so mind-blowingly obvious (it will almost always reduce you to Wake, Starks, Soliai, and Langford. It's the formation that was succesful for us in 2001 with Minor out of the backfield. It produces points, it's not great unless you have a great QB but it's frightening extremely frightening because it leaves a team without a great basic rush mind-blowingly cluster-****ed. The Patriots with Cassell dropped it on us last season. It's such an effective cheap way to produce an offense. The only thing you need is the offensive line. Pencil in Buffalo for a left tackle in this draft. I have a strange feeling that Gailey will make that offense quite decent.
Pats played Cassel only one yr and Haley traded for him and gave him a huge contract, point being HC's like having their own Qb's, so unless K Stewart is on the comeback trail that leaves Thiggy.
Thigpen is better than white and Thigpen won more games for KC than Cassell did. I agree with Muck. And IMO White isnt an NFL qb he is a slash/wildcat qb nothing more. Thigpen can pass the ball and play from traditional sets.
The kids stock is on the rise, he flashed against the steelers and he's got legit starts in this league under bad conditions, and the tape dont lie. Imo, theres no long term future for the player, henne is entrenched, so the best thing to do is develope the strategy to showcase the player and play the game of drafting high round developement qb's and selling them for low round draft picks...From a 5 to a 2 would be sweet, as soon as we think we prepped him enough, let him play extended snaps in the preseason and keep teasin the desperate teams.
Landshark, i agree with you up until the point where we can get a 2nd for the player, then move him for the pick cause he's not gonna threaten Henne.
Well that's just it bro. It all comes down to a couple things non of which is what did we give for Thiggy. A) do you feel he is a quality backup or has starting potential? I say he is but that's just my opinion. b) How much is a quality backup with starting potential worth? I say its a minimum of a second round pick some other say its a 3rd and a few say its lower. After we have answered that question we have to ask ourselves the next logical question. Now that we have delt our backup whats it going to cost us to replace him with another quality backup? Once these questions are answered then its a simply matter of subtraction to figure out our net gain, if any.
if we intend to keep Pennington & can get something decent out of trading Thigpen, then it only makes sense
thats a good take, imo, If a backup player moves his way up the value chart to 2nd round value around the league, and your starter is young and entrenched, I think you gotta move the player, cant have that 2nd round value sittin on the bench when you can flip the talent of a 2nd round pick into another position of need, possible starter.
