I agreed it's irrelevant to a point because it is so far off, but the question about Ginn's future with the franchise makes you pull back a bit and look at the bigger picture. Does Ginn really fit this offensive system long term. Why can't that question be asked? This is a message board where discussion takes place. I don't see why that question is any less worthy than a host of other threads/posts that are created. I'm sorry you don't deem it worthy of discussion, but honestly I think prez's reply was a quality and intelligent post and that alone in reality actually made it worth of discussion.
fitzgerald, breaston and ginn would be sick you would have to have your fastest on ginn and whats crazy is often times thats your best which would leave fitz and breaston on the slower ones
We need Ginn to turn around whatever the hell he isn't turning. He's the only guy so far that can get the chunk yardage. Freeman completes two passes of 30 yards or more on one drive against us. Our longest was 25 to Bess, and was there any YAC? (I coudn't watch the whole game as I was on my iphone in denver and there were service drop outs). And yes, in this game, blame goes to Ginn. I saw the beginning clear enough, and I saw he jumped too early and got his hands on the back of the football, not the front, and it goes through his hands. Unacceptable. I wouldn't even have been surprised if Henne didn't go to him again (but he did). Ginn's gettign open. We were worried about him not getting open. Now we gotta worry about his hands? When the ball is in the air the only thing Ginn should start thinking about is catching that ball. Block the defenders out his mind, block the route you had to run, block the yards after catch you want to make. He has had what, 5 drops in a row now? That's inexcusable and if he doesn't correct that, he should sit.
It can be asked, nothing says you can't ask it, I just thought it was irrelevant. I am allowed to voice my opinion of a topic, just as you are allowed to bring a topic up. Asking whether his style of play fits the team, and the question whether he'll be back after his contract is up are not the same question, and I find one to be a much more valid point of discussion.
Believe it or not, you're not the only one posting on this topic. What's the difference between Ted Ginn and Derius Heyward Bay? They were both drafted based on 40 time, but both cant catch a cold.
i think it was a good question and ive thought about it myself. i think stitches is simply thinking its too far off but ultimately thats going to determine whether there is a place for Ginn. i doubt its on the minds of our front office this second but by the offseason thats going to be a huge discussion. still plenty of football to be played and we'll see if Ginn can have a game or two where the potential we all see actually comes to fruition. i do have some questions regarding the playcalling not just with ginn but all the receivers. seems we could have better routes all around being called. i would really like to see more slants and drags called but maybe they dont want henne throwing those just yet since they tend to be more risky
This brings me back to the point I was making earlier - the FO really hedged their bets on Ginn by not having a single other speed threat on the roster. Ginn is falling apart but having a speed element is too important to sit him on the end of bench. Where is the Armstrong kid from training camp? Or anyone else for that matter? If we can bring in TE's and play them after two days you would think we could find someone with some speed to do the same.
Not only his drops, but his lack of manhood kills me more. He constattly runs out of bounds on returns. On the last kick off return he could of turned to his left and had a wide open field. Instead he just stepped oout of bounds. Maybe that what he wants to do is go out of bounds. I believe the Bucs knwe he would run out of bounds on the KR. Their players all started to slow down when he was close to the sideline. Maybe he's setting up the Pats by doing this and he'll surprise them when they slow up.
You didn't just say that if in Arizonan somebody would stick their best CB on Ginn did you? Seriously? No, I am asking, are you SERIOUSLY implying that?
Lol. Well that was the purpose of the question. Notice I didn't just ask if Ginn would be back. I asked WHY Ginn would be or not be back. And I also stated that he doesn't fit our system, he wasn't a great blocker, and he doesn't have great hands. The reason I included those points were to get the discussion going towards where he fits. I think it just boils down to you incorrectly interpreted my question. Different people could take different meanings out of the question. But the person I asked ( Prez ) understood the question and addressed it. So whatever.. go phins!?
clearly stated fastest. could be the best cb or could simply be the fastest. as a coach would you put your slowest on ginn? is that what you're implying? seriously? i mean if he was in arizona and we were playing him would you have smith or davis on ginn or would you put wilson or bell on him?
There's no doubt the man is afraid of contact, there's no doubt he lacks concentration. To me even the pass deep down the side line where he couldn't get two feet in was on him not Henne, almost every number one receiver would have got their feet in bounds, but Ginn wanted to avoid any potential contact. But what does make me feel sort of sorry for the guy is that all the fans are booing him now, it's not his fault the coaching staff keeps sending him out there, this must be making Ginn a mental case. Yes I don't like Ginn and I voice my opinion about him but I wouldn't boo him at a game.
Lol. He said you would have to stick your fastest CB on him. Just so happens that is normally your best :P. Ginn against a nickle back. I like that matchup. He just isn't going to get it here in Miami.
IF that were the scenario, it would be the Dime-backer cause it would mean the Cards had 5 Wide going on. That being said, I would cover him with Jason Allen. Doesn't matter if he beats him, chances are better that he drops it than catching it anyways
Seriously, if I see Fitz, Boldin, Eurben, Breaston and Ginn out there, Ginn is Waaaayyyyy down my priority list.
if i was a DB and saw Fitzgerald, Boldin, Breaston and Ginn on the field at the same time I would **** my pants. the thing with ginn getting on a dime back would be that instead of getting one step he would probably get two steps on him. makes it much easier to hit ginn in stride without ginn having to fight for the pass
I think the problem with Ginn and actually all of our WRs not named Camarillo is that CP throws a a very catchable ball compared to most any QB. Remember that last year we were either #1 or #2 in fewest drops. But Henne's passes get there much quicker, much harder and lack CP's touch. Now I don't want this to sound like I'm blaming Henne, I'm not. I just think that our WRs need to adapt and show a bit more receiving skill. Against TB, Bess finally seemed to be making that step. Hopefully it means that he has adapted. With Ginn I'm not sure whether he can adapt or not. I don't think he is an instinctive WR, but I do think he it is a skill that can be learned. Maybe they can set that juggs machine on high and just have him catch a few hundred extra passes a day. Since he's doesn't appear to be instinctive it may take a ton of work, but his work ethic has never been questioned.
You have a good point, but especially with Ginn, the drops started before Penny went down. I am ready to start blaming coaching. It isa almost epidemic.
I was at the game yesterday, and holy **** was Ginn open... ALOT. I counted at least 5 plays where he had beaten the defender deep and wasn't thrown the ball. If Henne had an extra spilt second on the Ronnie double-pass, you would've seen that no one was within 15 yards of Teddy.
its amazing though that peoople refuse to acknowledge that. someone on this board stated categorically that ginn was covered on that flea flicker even though you could see on the tv feed that he had beaten his man. it was obvious to everyone and yet people refuse to acknowledge it. people dont want to hear that he's getting open. it weakens their arguments against him. one of the real problems we have is what sparano has stated which is our pass blocking isnt giving these plays the time to develop so that we can hit the big plays. its frustrating but we gotta keep at it. eventually good things will come
Ted Ginn set the tone for yesterday's game on the first play and it wasn't to stretch the field. It was acknowledging that we have no deep passing game and he himself is a joke of a threat. I don't care what we get for him, I just want his sorry *** off this team.
I honestly believe Ginn did open up the passing game (and running game for that matter). Henne wasn't sacked the entire game and was only pressure a few times. I can't make excuses for Ginn, because he should've caught that first play pass of the game, but had Henne seen there was no other safety help on the play he could have lead Ginn a little more instead of throwing it over his shoulder.
Yeah but Pennington went down real early and he didn't drop passes this bad until Henne came in. I think Ginn is still adjusting to Henne's passes... if he adjusts to the point where he can catch the ball 70-80% of the time is unknown.
Ginn is done....the chances of him being on this team next year are pretty much zero. Take whatever pick we can get and let someone else over pay him and wait for him to sack up.
Well, that says one of three things was going on: 1) Henne didn't have enough time to find him-BUT Henne wasn't sacked all day 2) Henne just plain and simply didn't see him, which could be. 3)On as I mentioned about 2 weeks ago, Henne doesn't feel like watching his perfectly thrown passes go through wide open hands. Sooner or later, Henne IS going to lose all confidence in Ginn.
i am certain that ginn opens up both the passing and running games when he's in. the two weeks where they lessened the plays he was in for saw our lowest offensive production. i dont think that was mere coincidence. i will tell you what i liked about the play that ginn dropped was that he was running across the field rather than straight up the field. they have to use ginn even more on crossing routes, slants and drags. run some pick plays but get him in a position where you can lead him at full speed. i would like henne to be a touch more accurate but i think he's going to have to work on that in the offseason (especially on the deeper stuff). for the rest of this season henne is just going to get it near you and our receivers are goiing to have to get it
Id really like to know how he is creating space for the running game. Teams are putting a Cb on him, and keeping one safety back. That's stacking the box with 8 players. If he'd make them pay more, teams would have to stop cheating up the strong safety but most of the time its just not the case. He may help SOME on one side with the run game but if he was even more consistant in his routes and catch a ball inside once in a while, I'd agree a lot more. What we see now or most of a game is Ginn is shut down, or he shuts himself down, and until he gets more consistent, he's not helping that much at all....
No what you need is for Henne to be able to perfectly and softly drop each and every pass into the arms of that poor excuse of a WR....... And sorry, Ginn is doing NOTHING to help any facet of this offense. To do so he would actually have to catch one of those balls a lot more often than he does. Ginn has no business being sent out on that crossing route, his game is just too weak.
The Lb's and Defensive Line for Tampa were getting beat. That's what opened up the run game. The offensive line was kicking their butts at the point of attack. Ginn catches a couple of passes and especially the pass over the middle then it opens up the run more because they will have to stop cheating the SS. This is not so much Ginns fault but more the fault that they don't respect any of our Wr's. BUT if Ginn could land a couple and my goodness, if he could get into some of the open seams then teams will have to make their Lb's play some pass protections a lot deeper than what they are. This team could be scary in the run game with that...
