I'm out on Tannehill

Do I think Tannehill improved as an NFL QB in certain areas of his game this past season. Yes I Do.

Do I think that eventually he can lead this team to a winning season and a playoff spot. Again, yes I do.

Do I think he will ever get to the level where he can lead this team to a Super Bowl win. No I don't.

I just feel there are too many areas he is still weak in and I just don't see him ever being an elite or even top 10 type QB.
I see him as a mid tier NFL QB now and probably for the remainder of his career.

He is what he is. A very tough player with an accurate arm from 15 yards in. He can throw the ball deep and on occasion he can actually complete one of his deep passes. He has absolutely no feel in the pocket and I really haven't seen any improvement in this area of his game over the past three years.

I believe Tannehill is the best QB this team has had since Marino and I don't see any free agent QB's who the Dolphins can sign which will be better than Tannehill next year. I also don't see the Dolphins being able to draft one of the top QB's in next years draft.

So I expect Tannehill to continue to be the starting QB for the Dolphins until a new head coach takes over in a few years and realizes this team can only get so far will Tannehill as its QB.

I don't blame Tannehill for this years record. He certainly did his part to lead this team to more victories. I just think in the end, he is what he is. I look at Tannehill and I see a Matt Ryan type of QB. A QB that has decent stats and can lead his team to the playoffs on occasion, but just can't lead his team to the promise land.

That is certainly better than this team has had since Marino was in his prime and I'll take it for now. I just hope that one day in the not too distant future, this team finds that QB who you know can consistently put the team on his back in the 4th quarter of games and pull out victory after victory. To me those are the type QB's who are elite and the ones who get their team in the Super Bowl. To me, Tannehill hasn't shown this ability except on rare occasions over the last three years.

Right now Tannehill is better than what we have been accustomed to in recent years. He will do until Miami is fortunate enough to draft a QB who can actually become elite and who can take this team to the Super Bowl and win it. I just don't ever see that QB being Tannehill.

 

Deej,
I am just sure as all get-out happy that we did not have the internet and a board way back when Griese lost that 25 yard sack against Dallas in SB5, or 6, or whatever it was. You would need a resuscitator.

 

And actually that's going to happen more frequently on passing downs, and when the team is down big on the scoreboard. And this is where the Dolphins' passing game had problems performing successfully, despite that it had no greater percentage of sacks than other teams in those situations.

 

There's more reasons to be out on Dolphins fans than just you.

 

How about QBs that didn't go to the playoffs first three years in the league and went on to be a great QB? Why does not starting get a pass? If Garrard doesn't get hurt he's in the same company as Brees. And it's a meaningless data point. Steve Young was 2 and 14 both of his first two years in the NFL, throwing twice as many INTs as TDS, and that's after 2 years in the USFL. How does he fit in? You're taking a coincidence and trying to make it relavant. Tannehill's play and devolopment are Tannehill's play and devolopment. If Steve Young spent another year on the Bucs (no play offs) before being traded it doesn't change Ryan Tannehill's devolopment one iota. DJ is at least talking about what Ryan is or isn't doing.

 

Griese started majority of games his first three years and never made the playoffs, but he's in the HoF. Same for Joe Namath. Dan Fouts, HOF, didn't make playoffs until his 7th year. Warren moon, also in the HoF, didn't make it his 1st three seasons (despite beginning in the CFL). Fran Tarkenton didn't make it until like his 13th season of starting, still in the HoF.

And Eli Manning had immediate success despite sitting, as if he was what got them in the playoffs? His 2nd year in the league was worse than what Tannehill did last year. Oh, he made the playoffs that year? Go look at some of the **** shows they managed to win where he was statistically bad. That team won 5 regular season games where Eli had a rating under 70. They won 5 in that season alone, but Tannehill for his career is 1-10 in such games.

 

Over the last five games, Tannehill threw for almost 1500 yards, 8 tds 2 ints. He averaged 292 a game, and had at least 3 dropped deep ball tds. So, yes, I'd like a little better production, would like more wins, but it's not like he was playing like crap, either.

 

Wouldn't that be on the coordinator to call those plays?

 

not to mention aaron rodgers sat 3 years and took over a 14-2 team that went to the NFC championship game the previous year. im pretty sure if tannehill was handed a 14-2 team after sitting on a bench for 3 years watching a hall of famer play the game, he would have made the playoffs in his first 3 years too. instead tannehill took over a 6-10 team who traded away their best player and he wasn't allowed to sit he was thrown into the pool and told sink or swim, and the guy has done nothing but improve vastly every single year. is he perfect? no far from it but the guy is getting better and better and already has played at a top 10 level for most of the year. some people act like we have geno smith or christian ponder as quarterback.

 

Pretty sure he means that he wants Tannehill to improvise and make something out of nothing with his legs, regardless of the play call if he sees that the pocket is collapsing. I agree to a certain extent that he needs to improve his maneuvaribility in the pocket and make more plays with his legs a la Aaron Rodgers, but I think in that last game he really had no chance.

And as someone here said already, can't recall who, he has good acceleration and straight-line speed, but isn't as shifty and agile as some other QB's out there, which makes it harder to evade pressure the way they do. In that department, it's like he's the opposite of Drew Brees, who I belive has good lateral quickness but is slow when running straight-line.

 

I honestly don't think you are taking into account what exactly our offense is DJ. One of your points.. Tom Bradys run. Dj Brady made that run because not on defensive player thought he would run and he had nobody near him for like 10 yards. Do you think Ryan is ever going to see that?

Our offense is set up for a pocket passer who can also run in designed running plays, I. E. read option. When a passing play is called, it's for progressions across the entire field. He has 3 to 4 route options. The snap is made and he begins his progressions. Now if he's seeing option one, then bailing, he's not reading his other 3 options. Remember he's just learning this offense. Ryan will hang in there till the bitter end to go through his progressions because that is what they want him to do. Lazor has already said Ryan wants to run more then what Lazor wants him to.

I really believe we are clear on your analysis on 17 as a QB... When it comes to running. I really would love to read what your thoughts are on the other 80, 90 percent of what he does as a QB. Put aside running.. And critique him as a pocket passer.

 

But it's not big pic.. Because u are hyper focused on one small area of his QB play

 

This just in. After 26 pages, Ryan Tannehill's feelings are officially hurt now. Thanks guys.

 

That was me. Ryan is fast running in a straight line. Russell Wilson has amazing side to side agility and coordination which is why he was also a great infield baseball player, his rights are currently owned by the Texas Rangers.

 

B

When Tannehill wins two Super Bowls as the QB of his team, the comparison to Eli Manning will make sense. That is why stats are irrelevant. The fact is that once the Giants got into the playoffs, Manning made the plays to lead his team to victories in two Super Bowls.

I think comparing Tannehill to QB's in the HOF or QB's who have lead their team SB wins is rather silly. Especially when he hasn't even led this team to a winning record in the past three years.

You have other young QB's like Luck who came in his first year and took the worst team in the league the previous year to the playoffs. Several other young QB's in the past three years have also taken over previous losing teams and led them to the playoffs. In fact Russell Wilson was drafted in the same draft as Tannehill, only much later, and he is a much better QB at this time.

You want to compare these young QB's to the greatest of all time, I have no problem with that. But comparing a QB who has a 23-25 record in the NFL doesn't make much sense at this time.

 

the colts were hardly the worst team in the NFL, they tanked to get luck. the colts had 9 straight winning seasons including 2 trips to the superbowl prior to them tanking. the colts were far better than 2-14 but trotting out the likes of dan orlovsky and curtis painter really made sure they would have gotten that # 1 pick

 

AFC South.

 

could explain why andrew lucks qb rating inside his division is 111.2 and outside of his division 89.2

 

The comparison exists because I was replying to a discussion where it was said there was NO great QBs EVER who didn't get to the playoffs in their first three years of starting.

If You want to act like I am silly for rebutting a point, or as if my examples were made to make Tannehill look great, when I have readily said he is not a great QB right now and have said Luck and Wilson are better QBs today, please just refrain from replying to me.

 

i think they get the point but they don't care since it doesn't fit their agenda. no one knew what griese was going to be but if some of the people on here used the same line of thinking in regards of griese as they do tannehill, he would have been considered mediocre and deemed "never would win a superbowl" instead the guy goes to three superbowls winning 2 going onto a hall of fame career.

luck and wilson are better than tannehill no doubt but that does not equal in tannehill being bad and not a franchise qb. is andrew luck a give me to a win a superbowl? no there is no such thing as a sure thing. andrew luck has had his struggles to, his oline is doing him no favors and it has shown in the last month. all qb's will struggle in their careers and nothing is guaranteed.

 

According to Football Outsiders Miami's o-line is ranked 21st at pass pro and Seattle's is 24th. And Seattle has the number 1 rushing attack and Miami is number 2. Everything considered, I would say they are pretty even.

 

Now use your own eyes.. And tell me this

 

My eyes tell me Russell Wilson is an elite QB. He avoids a lot of sacks. He accounts for a lot of their rushing yards, which makes things easier on his line, his running backs and his own passing game.

 

Is he really that elusive, though? I mean, nothing against Russell Wilson, and I do think he lives up to the hype. But as much as some people want to get on Ryan Tannehill for taking too many sacks, Wilson has only taken 4 less sacks than Tannehill (42 to Ryan's 46).

 

Wilson had 34 plays in 2014 in which he rushed for 10 or more yards. The average distance to a first down on those plays was over 10 yards, and on over 88% of those plays he made a first down. 9 of those plays were on 3rd down, and 21 of them involved a 7 to 10-yard distance to a first down. Tannehill on the other hand had 12 such plays, and only one of them was on 3rd down.

 

And this is where we have a problem, because nobody is going to pin down with any certainty how much to attribute sacks to a team's offensive line versus its quarterback.

 

Let's put this into context. Dan Marino only had 4 seasons with a better QB rating than RTH. He had a 4 year stretch when he went 29-31. Does that mean that he sucked during that time period or perhaps the team around him wasn't that good?

Hell the argument against him being one of the all time greats is that he never won the big game. It's a crazy argument because football is a TEAM sport. A QB, while the most important position on the field, can only do so much with the talent around him.

As far as the other QB comparisons:
Steve Young inherited a Championship Team.
Brett Favre took 4 seasons to get more than 10 wins and he didn't have a better QB rating than RTH's year this year until year 4.
Rodgers was 6-10 in his 4th season in the NFL. Oh yeah, his rating was about the same as RTH's in his 4th year
Additionally, Kurt Warner didn't even get a start in the NFL until his 6th season as a pro.

The problem with RTH is we've had to sit through his growing pains because he has started since day 1 out of necessity. Others had the luxury of developing without the critical eye of the fan. I don't think anyone is saying that RTH doesn't need to get better or improve, especially if we're ever going to be a playoff team.

He has improved his rating every year he's been in the NFL including an 11 point increase since last year. Can we at least agree that he is improving and cut him a break?

I mean, jesus christ, he has taken a beating of epic proportions. Part of it is due to him, the other part of it is due to having one of the worst pass blocking OL in the NFL the last 2 seasons. Half of this thread is comparing him to Russell Wilson which is f**king insane because he benefits from the best defense in the NFL and one of the best running games in the NFL. They can win without him.

How much easier would it be if play action actually created some good opportunities?
How much easier would it be to close out a game if you could pick up a first down running the ball to close out a game?
How much easier would it be to close out a game when your defense doesn't allow 70+yard game winning drives likes it's their business?
How much easier would it be to watch when you can run the ball when your QB is having an off day?

 

99 percent of fans in NFL would take RW3 over RT17, and its so obvious RW3 is just a naturally better QB then RT17(RW3 intangibles are way better). The one percenters are the diehard Phins fans. The real debate is AL12 vs RW3... RT17 is the afterthought.

 

Every quarterback has taken sacks they should not have. But I think it's safe to assume that when your QB is taking 40+ sacks like Ryan and Wilson, you have an O-line problem.

 

Know who Ryan reminds me of, in this sense? Brian Hartline.

Both straightline runners with little lateral stability or wiggle.