Again don't disagree I am not saying all of the contract leading up until he is 38. That contract may very well suck the last few years. I am saying I believe he produces for 2/3 of it so with that then add the leadership factor he brings, add that 14 million isn't budget sinking like 20 plus and last Boston is a large market team and can operate comfortably at 180m. They aren't worried about it.
I think with his skill set even when he hits the normal decline guys typically do when they age he'll still be valuable. Don't forget that Pedroia will be making close to what FA that get offered arbitration would get on a 1 year deal that accepts it. I think the years and dollar amount is very team friendly.
Here's a good take on the Pedroia contract: http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/red-sox-extend-dustin-pedroia-at-ian-kinsler-price/
I don't have any issue with the dollar amount. He's arguably the best or second best 2nd baseman in the league. I'm just not convinced he'll produce like that for much longer, considering he's on the wrong side of 30. Even with his value on defense, if his hitting declines the deal will look bad.
He's not even 30 yet though, he turns 30 in August I believe so how is he on the wrong side of 30? Even if he follows the natural decline in skills as he ages, based on his skill set he still should hold value because of his plus defense and his on base skills. He's not someone like Ryan Howard who all he does is hit HRs so when his bat speed goes he's done. Player's like Pedroia, unless they have a serious injury, tend to age well and don't drop off a cliff suddenly. Even when he declines the contract is still very team friendly. I think most people are looking at the age he will be when it ends and not the money involved. Again though you have to look at the 14 million per year. Right now it looks very a bargain and in a few years it might be a steal based on inflation of arbitration FA contracts. Seriously take a look at my previous post from Fangraphs, it's a pretty good article.
Even now 14M isn't that much money for a player, and again in 7 years it is going to be peanuts....Pedoria will age like Jeter, he doesn't rely on HR's for his numbers, he is a OBP guy.....scores runs...
Yeah exactly. The players that usually get handed these huge dollar/year contracts are the superstar sluggers who play a corner position and really just hit HRs so once they start to decline they're almost useless because they don't bring added value in terms of defense/speed etc. With Pedroia's skill set, even when he starts the natural decline will still hold value especially at an up the middle position.
Here's another good article explaining why the extension was a good move for the Sox: http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-t...port-laser-show-locked-up-os-pen-gets-a-boost
I meant he's going on the wrong side of the 30. I don't think he'll hit well enough to be valuable at 14 million a season even with his defense. He's not even that valuable base running wise. Compared to the rest of the contracts, it might not look that bad. But there's a chance you'll be paying 14 million a season for a player who's only strength is above average defense. That doesn't sound like a good contract to me. Obviously, there's a chance he can still hit and play well enough so it's a wait and see.
I still don't get the wrong side of 30 comment. He turns 30 in August, unless you mean that any day after a player turns 30 it's the wrong side of 30. Anyway do you realize what 14 million a year in baseball gets you nowadays? And baseball contracts aren't going down in the future, that fact that FA arbitration contract offers might be more then what he'll make a year is pretty crazy too. If this was a 20 plus million dollar contract I'd be right there with you but because the dollar amount is so low even if he stops hitting in year 5 or so yet still plays above average defense at 2B it still might justify yearly salary.
Since his rookie year he has the 5th highest WAR in the game and the locked him up under market value.... I wish Cano would do the same deal ~
"the wrong side of 30" is more of a football comment than baseball........ football after 30 at skill position are just hard, but you can play baseball very nicely after 30....
5th highest among 2nd baseman? I'm not in front of a computer, but that stat is extremely hard to believe if you meant in all of baseball. For instance. The past 4 seasons(including this year) Ben Zobrist has a higher WAR then Pedroia. That's also considering Zobrist is having a sub par year to his standards. Zobrist is making 4.5 mil and at the peak of his contract he's making 7.5 mil. Contracts ends at 35 years, which is the correct ending point IMO.
I think baseball is much more effected by the 30s in today's game then in the past. Without all the PEDs, even little things like greenies, it seems what once was a prime that lasted well into your 30s is no more.
5th highest player period. If you dont like it blame ESPN they are the one that mentioned it. Fangraphs has him as 7th.... http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.as...7&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0
Don't forget though that Zobrist plays multiple positions, thus effecting his WAR for the positive. Zobrist is a very good and underrated player but Pedroia is better. EDIT: Also depends on which WAR you're looking at it looks like FanGraphs favors Pedroia a bit in certain years compared to BR. Pedroia has the higher total career WAR on both FG and BR.
I just want to reiterate. I think Pedroia is a fine player, I think the amount he's getting is completely fine and he's well worth it. The problem doesn't begin for another 4 or 5 years. When he hits 34 years of age and he's OPSing 750 with about average defense for 14 million I think that's where the problem starts. And you have that problem for the next 4 years. Obviously we will see what the market is like in 5 years, maybe 14 million is what a just above average player is worth then. But I don't think the market has changed all that dramatically from today to 5 years earlier.
I didn't say I didn't like it. I said it was hard to believe. Not sure why your getting defensive about a Red Sox player. And I don't care what he did 6 and 7 years ago honestly.
I dont say things if i cant back them up. I am a Yankee fan but also a fan of baseball. I could care less that Pedroia plays for the Red Sox he has been one the best players in the game since he was called up.
I just think that his leadership value means more to the Sox, so I do agree Nappy that the last 3 years maybe be avg for him, but they are comfortable overpaying him as he is/will be the face of that franchise (obviously Papi will be gone) and at that point he will be Hall ready (if he keeps up the stats)....that they don't care about eating that 14 for 3 years...Again the Sox will comfortable operate at 180-195M if they so choose you know? As well it isn't like the Sox will be handing out monster contracts all the time, I believe they have learned their lesson with that....if they at that point have him as the highest paid player on that team at 14M they will ecstatic...I believe they will too, unless something crazy like Kershaw becomes a free agent inexplicably.... They don't have to watch their payroll, even now it is at 154M, peanuts to that team....it is pretty much the same thing as Jeter (who is pretty much the most overpayed player in the history of the game)....
Yes, that's what I meant by wrong side of 30. The years after 30. The right side are the years before 30. I know how contracts are inflated but a second baseman who loses his bat but is still an above average defender is not worth 12-16 million a season. If he still keeps at least an average bat with his defense, then this contract will be fine. My worry is if he loses his bat completely as he ages. His defense won't be enough to justify the salary, especially in the middle of the contract.
See I think the opposite, I can see DP losing a little bit of range in the field before his bat goes.....he doesnt really have a zone, he covers so much of the plate....the guy is just a good hitter....
Usually guys that have a good eye at the plate (ie takes pitches, walks etc) and makes a lot of contact tend to age better offensively.
Ortiz got a little angry today. You won't like Ortiz when he's angry. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
That was literally stuff of legends right there, DP'd face was awesome.....I like Papi always have....
Hey Nappy, you might want to think about adding Bogaerts to your fantasy team. Pure speculation but I think he'll be the Sox starting 3B by mid August. He just continues to rake at Triple A and has played 3rd 2 times in the last 5 games. With Iglesias slumping and Middlebrooks not really making many improvements, I think the Sox turn to Xander soon.
Ha!! Man, I looked his name up back when we talked about him and he was already on a team. This league is so ridiculously deep that top prospects and prospects that are playing well are already on someones team.
20 team league. C, 1B, 2B, SS, 3B, LF, CF, RF, UTILITY, 6 SP and 3 RPs. Then we have 7 bench spots. It is usually a 18 team league and we bumped it up to 20. We are going back to 18 next season. 20 is just a tad to much. With Braun getting suspended I have Dayan Viciedo starting in LF for me....yea....
Yeah that's pretty hardcore. The draft must take forever. In a league that deep, Viciedo as the LFer isn't so bad. Sorry that Ted Lilly advice didn't work out for you but on the bright side Wade Davis might have hurt you more if you kept him.
Yea that didn't hurt much honestly. What hurt was I had this stupid idea that the MLBPA wouldn't allow any MLB players to be suspended this season for this crap storm going on right now. So I traded Soriano and Markakis for Braun and Vargas. Well Soriano has proceeded to hit really well the minute I traded him. I got like 2 games out of Braun because of Injury and funerals he attended, and then he was suspended. So that totally screwed me. Then I had Marcel Ozuna who despite being sent down produced decently for me in this league, get hurt and get sent down. So I went from being extremely set and DEEP at OF to screwed. The draft takes forever because we do everything the purist way. We do auction draft. So you want a player you have to pay for said player. You also have to manage money. So bidding goes back and forth for good players for minutes sometimes. We made the league into a keeper league this season for the first time, 5 keepers with 20% inflammation on their drafted money, so hopefully that will help the draft time a little bit. We have had this league for about 8 years now. Its amazing.
Man you would. If you love and know the game in depth, you would absolutely love it. It was tiring. But I enjoyed it. Also. I just traded for Bogaerts and Doubront. Doubront has pitched well lately. Bogaerts was a throw in.
