Post your vids, thoughts on Vance here. I hadn't heard of him, really, until the Senior Bowl. The reports sound so good I plan to watch this kid's film. Would like to figure out which round he could go in and if he's a viable option for us at tight end. From the NY Times Senior Bowl Practice coverage: http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/01/24/senior-bowls-surprises-polarizing-prospects-and-small-school-standouts/
Vance McDonald's Combine numbers are worthy of a look... 6-4 267lbs 34 3/8 inch arm length (just 1/8 shorter than Toilolo who had the longest arms of any TE at the combine, Vance being second-longest) 31 reps bench press (best among TEs. Next best was Ertz at 24) 4.69 40-time (5th fastest TE, just 0.01 seconds behind Eifert) 33.5 inch vertical (6th best of TEs) 119 inches Broad Jump (tied for 2nd best, behind Gragg and tied with Eifert) 7.08 sec Cone (tied for 3rd best, with Gragg and Ertz) 11.73 sec 60-yd Shuttle (3rd best, right behind Eifert) This is a guy whose buzz at the Shrine week and game helped get him invited to the Combine. Just how good a prospect is Vance?
Re-visiting an old topic here. First off just for the record I was at Shrine practice and Vance McDonald wasn't there. He was an outright invite to the Senior Bowl. After looking at a fair amount of Rice tape, I have Vance right up there with Travis Kelce who is probably my favorite tight end in the Draft not named Tyler Eifert. Vance is real similar to Travis Kelce. Similar builds. Both of them are built like a chest of drawers, as I've heard Simon say about Travis. Both can get up the field and run, yet both have the balance and quickness into and out of their breaks, the attention to detail to present their numbers to the quarterback and to come back for the football. That makes them both quarterback friendly players. Based on 2011 tape you would say that Travis is just a far and away better blocker than Vance, but in 2012 McDonald developed the same kind of nasty streak you see out of Travis Kelce on nearly every play. McDonald's lower body is built well with great bubble and explosive ability, so he's able to put paid to his will to dominate by sticking with blocks and sustaining until he buries opponents. That's one thing I've always loved about Travis Kelce. Kelce is probably still overall the better blocker but Vance is quickly developing and has shown proper attitude. Where they differentiate is that Travis has the better set of hands and ability to pull the ball in outside of his frame. Yet, on the other hand, Vance is a more polished run after catch guy and transitions from catch to run more smoothly, more balanced, and more explosively than perhaps any other tight end in this Draft. That makes a comparison of the two a tough call. The key will probably be investigating the rumors of Kelce's character issues and the reason he was suspended an entire year by his team.
I really like McDonald. Very fluid athlete. I think he's going to be drafted much higher than people think. Early 2nd wouldn't surprise me.
Wherever Travis Kelce could go if his character checks out, that's where Vance McDonald could go. One catches the football a lot better and blocks better, but the other runs after the catch better. That's kind of a wash.
In particular I was asked to write a piece on Jordan Reed's fit for Chip Kelly's offense in Philadelphia. I asked if I had to just write about Reed because I wanted to write a comparative piece as the first thing I think of with a tight end in Kelly's offense is run after catch, and the first tight end I think of when it comes to run after catch is Vance McDonald. I did a fairly deep exploration on film though the write-up was not necessarily deep. In short, there's no comparison. It's not that the two players are different types of player that will play different roles. One is just head and shoulders superior to the other. Jordan Reed has bad size and strength and can't sustain blocks or be any more than a speed bump blocker. He lacks the leg strength or lower body explosion to stick with blocks or be as dynamic after the catch as Vance McDonald. Reed is about as good after the catch as you'd expect of an average player his size and with his kind of experience running with the ball in his hands, but Vance is just a far smoother and more balanced player when it comes to transitioning from catch to run. He also has the strength to break tackles and launch himself even while going to ground for that extra 3 or 4 yards. It takes tremendous lower body strength to do that. Jordan Reed can't. Where Vance also differentiates is how quarterback friendly he is compared with Reed. He presents his numbers to the quarterback and is much quicker into and out of breaks, more balanced. He comes back to the football and has a "my ball" mentality. Jordan Reed is much more passive with the ball in the air. The only real area where Reed may have McDonald is consistency of hands. But Reed's hands aren't that great either so that's hard to say.
Thanks for the Shrine correction. Thought I'd read that somewhere, but I was clearly mistaken. Yeah, McDonald certainly intrigues, but he's firmly on the radar for teams and isn't a 'sleeper' pick anymore. I like sleeper picks because you get better value. Not sure I want to expend a 2nd on McDonald, but I would trust our staff's evaluation. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Well I clearly need to watch a bunch more Vance McDonald because I think Jordan Reed is unbelievable with the ball in his hands. Except that's not a fair assessment when comparing him to other tight ends because at Jordan Reeds size, he SHOULD be more mobile and elusive than most tight ends. He is undersized, and more of a tweeter. Even Hernandez is bigger, and better. That said, I still think there is chance Reed makes an impact in the right WCO. He is amazingly natural and fluid as an athlete, catches the ball decently, but as you say, is little more than an interference blocker and even sucks at that at times. He really plays like a slot WR in a bigger frame. I'll watch some Vance McDonald. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
I've looked at several games of both. McDonald looks like a more fluid athlete and runner. Just more athletic. Kelce is a stout blocker and I didn't see McDonald play as much along the line of scrimmage. He did seems more like a flex, h-back type. Does well blocking in the open field against DBs. Will be interesting to see how he fairs on a consistent basis against bigger OLBs and DEs. The negative for me with McDonald is that every game I saw him play - he drops passes. And that article above noted that in the practices. May be a concentration issue but that still is a negative. I remember James Pruitt getting open a good bit but dropping passes. That is a concern. If he caught everything in sight, McDonald would be quite a weapon. He has big hands. What is also interesting is that McDonald carries that weight pretty well. Kelce measured 6'5, 255 at the combine. He looks thick - like a block - on the field. McDonald wen't 6'4, 267 at the Combine and when he plays he does not look quite as thick to me - actually looks longer - and a bit more fluid running. I suspect both - if they work hard and are in the right system - can be solid players.
Need to distinguish between 2011 and 2012 tape on McDonald...if you're looking at blocking and hands. If you're doing a round of YouTube videos then half what you find is going to be 2011 but 2012 is more relevant.
