Two things. 1. You don't beat press coverage with quickness. You beat it with your footwork and your hands. Yes, you have to be quick, but quickness alone won't do it. 2. Austin will be going up against cornerbacks in the NFL that are just as fast and quick as he is.
When, like once every 2 years? Second, Austin has outstanding feet and quick, coordinated hands with some decent upper body strength. Third, how often do you actually expect him to be pressed in the slot?
None. That's why he will be limited to the slot. He lacks the size, strength, and technique at this point to get off press coverage playing the split end and flanker positions.
IF... he had any problem with the press at flanker, just motion him. If Bess can play there and beat the jam, I'm confident that Austin can. How do you know he lacks the technique? Did you see him try to beat the press in college and fail?
1. Austin is certainly capable of doing any honing necessary in his technique to beat the jam. If Bess can do it, then so can Austin. You talk as if you think he'll be hopelessly inept at it for his entire career. 2. There maybe a few corners as quick and fast but they are a minority. How many corners can run a 4.25 forty?
He may be able to beat the press at the next level, but you don't know that. Or if he will hold up physically. You don't draft a player like that at 12. In the second, sure.
He won't be pressed much if at all in the slot, so I'm not sure why it's being made into an issue, and I'm not sure why you think being physical is the only way to beat the press. Besides, we don't know that any draftable player can do anything at the next level; it's all speculation. Secondly, we don't know who will or won't hold up physically, period. Did you know the 6'7 315 pound Long would be constantly dinged up? Should we have opted for that 6'10 400 pound russian bear instead of our diminutive choice at left tackle? How about 6'4 202 Sidney Rice who was injured 2 straight years?.... or the beastly Adrian Peterson blowing out a knee? Did the 6'3 220 pound Andre Johnson fake his injury last year that cost him 9 games since only small players get injured according to you? Did the caveman Rob Gronkowski's massive size prevent him from breaking an arm? Hard to imagine little 5'8 1/2 Wesley Welker has missed only 3 games in 9 years, with 672 catches the past 6 years. How 'bout the tiny 5'9 178 pound Warrick Dunn racking up 15,000 scrimmage yards in 12 mostly healthy years? Or the 5'9 184 pound Steve Smith enjoying a nice 12 year career with 11,000+ yards? The frail-looking 175 pound Marvin Harrison missed only 5 games in 11 years. 5'6 187 pound Darren Sproles has missed only 3 games in 7 years from injury, and it was a hand injury at that. How many injuries has the 178 pound skinny Ginny had in 6 years other than a bruised vagina?
Any player we draft at 12 could turn out to be injury prone. Size, a lot of it or a little of it, does not seem to go hand in hand with injury risk from what I can tell. Austin because of his elusiveness seldom takes really hard shots when he is tackled. That in theory should help him more than a player who absorbs a lot of contact.
Makes sense, pappy. What about any notion that the heavier the player is the more stress put on cartilage, ligaments, tendons, etc? Not to mention we play our home games on grass so that'll reduce the risk of knee or ankle injury.
He only ran routes from the slot and the backfield in college, so no. I didn't see him vs press coverage, and this is why taking him at 12 is a tremendous issue. You just don't take guys his size with this high of a pick. So, are you telling me that you would take Tavon Austin at 12 over a guy like Cordarrelle Patterson? Oh, and his official time was 4.34, not 4.25. There are a lot of cornerbacks in the NFL that can match his speed. The best one in this draft timed at a 4.37, and he has 20-30 lbs on Austin. You know who isn't at a size disadvantage and is just as fast at Tavon Austin? Ryan Swope, who is a great fit for the offense and is a guy that can play both inside and outside at the receiver position. Plus, he already has a great rapport with Ryan Tannehill, and the two of them combined to produce an offense in 2011 that was 7th best in college football, averaging 490 yards per game and almost 40 points per game.
There are reasons to not draft every player out there, but what we need, and would get with Austin, is he is not only a slot guy, but he is a play maker. We need that at any position. We need difference makers and he has a chance to be special. In one of the highlight videos of Austin, the opposing HC said the other WR Stedman and QB Smith are in sinc with each other but Austin is the guy they are worried about. This is what Gil Brandt says about Austin...........Austin (5-8 1/2, 174), whose 4.34 40 tied for second-fastest at the combine, can run out of the backfield or catch passes. He'll be a matchup nightmare for defenses. His quickness is just unbelievable, and he can play all over the field, like Darren Sproles -- but better. He would be very effective in the Texans' play-action offense. That was taken from his mock draft on NFL.com
So it all comes down to his size? If he were 2 inches taller and ten lbs heavier then no problem? Patterson to me looks like just as big a risk if not more so than Austin. The official times did not make sense. They showed a simulcast of Austin and Goodwin, who's official was 4.27. There is no way in hell those two were actually .07 difference in time. I'd take Austin and come back in the late 2nd and take Swope too. We should draft 2 WRs.
Right. But it's still a risk with his size. That's something you take into account with the 12th overall pick. I wouldn't mind him at 2a but at 12 is a huge reach. Besides, I would rather have Bailey.
Injuries can happen at any size. Often bigger receivers are more injury prone than smaller ones. He won't come close to making it to pick 42. He'll be long gone. I like Bailey too, so we could come back in the 3rd and take him. He's not all that big either, nor as strong or nearly as far as Austin. What tells you he could beat press coverage any better? Right now NFLDraftScout.com rates Austin 24th and Bailey 107th overall.
Yes, any player can get injured at any time. Austin is more susceptible due to his size. Sure, he probably won't get hit as much, but one day he could be Pat White. Maybe not, but it's still a risk. A hit that wouldn't hurt other players as much could crush Austin. I'm not sure if Bailey could beat press coverage. Bailey isn't small, though. 195 on a 5'10 frame is built well. I would rather take Bailey at 42 than Austin at 12. If Austin isn't there at 42, that sucks. No way I take him at 12.
I do not agree that Austin is more susceptible due to his size. Adrian Peterson is just as likely to get hurt as Darren Sproles. What this entire argument boils down to is, we disagree. I won't change your mind, and you won't change mine. I'd take Austin at 12. You wouldn't. You cannot convince me it is a bad idea. I cannot convince you it is a good idea.
Not many understand how thick bone density and musculature can come in small packages, they just think because he's short he won't last.. Dude is going to light the NFL up..
I can see the angle of value when it comes to Swope one round later..your talking about a double package of players and which package would be better, I can see that argument, for example, Eifert/Swope..or Austin/ 2nd rounder..
C, can you put the play at 4:05 in your sig, it shows that he's not just an explosive athlete running around, it shows awareness on the field, and being a receiver, not many little guys can make that catch...4:25 shows what he can do with a handoff..Also shows multiple returns for tds from special teams..triple threat.
4:05 of what video? I don't make gifs btw. I just search google images for them, and look for one I like.
If I may ask you this, I see what your saying in terms of lining up and playing all three positions, I agree that may not be his style, but, finding a receiver that can do that, over what this kid can do if used correctly, is more important to the outcome of the game and scoring points?
Sorry bub, don't worry about it, I forgot to post the link, lol, here ya go, just check the play out at 4.05..must be a football player, must have awareness of the field, must have receiver instincts to make the play..basically Tavon is a very fast football player. http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7Q3UOd9_Tkw
Totally. I definitely do not want Patterson at 12. If it was just between the two, I would definitely take Austin over Patterson. I really want Swope in the 2nd. Ideally, I would like to trade down and get Eifert in the first and Swope in the second, but I don't like to even consider trade downs because the possibilities are so unknown and just about every team would like to trade down.
I don't see how you can really put a lot of value on Austin as a regular rusher. Maybe as an occasional jet sweep guy or something like that, but he's got three games in that role and that Oklahoma game is a big game for pretty much whomever you put in the backfield. Percy Harvin was way more accomplished as a rusher in college and he doesn't have that big of an impact as a professional.
Here's an interesting stat for you. Tavon Austin gained 15+ yards on 22.5% of his receptions. Ryan Swope gained 15+ yards on 32% of his receptions. This number was 29% last year with Tannehill as his quarterback, so this is something that he has consistently shown. His film backs it up as well. The two on receptions of 25+ yards? Austin is at 12%, and Swope is at 17%. Who is the bigger big play threat as a receiver? The numbers show that it is Swope.
No, I'm not claiming he wasn't successful from the backfield, I'm just claiming you can't read too much into it given how many of those plays saw him able to hit his designed aiming point at a dead run and be untouched before he is down the field, immediately putting him in space. You can't really expect him to get those plays as a professional that frequently, and I think you've got to see a lot more before you think he's going to be that productive there.
Another stat, since we are looking for guys that can put the ball into the endzone: Tavon Austin caught 27% of WVU's touchdown passes. Ryan Swope caught 29% of Texas A&M's touchdown passes. Last year, Swope caught 39% of TAMU's touchdown passes while Austin caught 25% of WVU's. On the WVU team this past year, the guy with the monster numbers is Stedman Baily. He caught a whopping 57% of WVU's touchdown passes on the year, the highest percentage of any player I have graded this year. Also, as a "big play" threat, 28% of Bailey's receptions went for 15+ yards. I really don't see how you justify taking Tavon Austin at 12 when he wasn't even the best receiver on his team.
a player benefitting from the space created by the threats Austin puts on a defense. I do think the debate between Swope and Austin is an interesting one, Swope gives you more size so you can do some things there, he's not the open field runner that Austin is but is pretty good in his own right, one you can get a round later, you have the connection to the Qb and coordinator that should account for something..
Swope was used on a lot of bubble and wide receiver screens as well. I don't have his exact breakdown from a distance standpoint. I know that on film, it looks like Swope runs more intermediate routes than Austin. Austin is mostly a screen/flat route guy. I think that accounts for about 56% of all his receptions, or something like that.
I still say it is the other way around. Bailey drawing cornerback and safety help up top helped keep Austin matched up against linebackers or nickle safeties on most occasions from what I've seen on film.
For his career he rushed for over 1000 yards on about 110 carries..had a career average running of 9.5... Not to shabby with a good amount of data..I actually can't find anyone else with better stats for over 100 carries. Tavon Austin did not miss a game in his high school or College career. Quote from Tavon Austin.." I'm the best overall football player in the draft" Confident lil mother.
Austin has really good awareness on the field, the angles for which he runs is excellent, he's got incredible speed, infinite quickness, good hands, I feel confident that he is the more dangerous player that d coordinators were worried about, if you give this kid an inch, he's housing it KB, you always have to be on guard when this guy is on the field, I think bailey benefitted from that myself.
