Speaking of Givens, his teammate from last year wouldn't look too bad in the later rounds. [video=youtube;yK_A3yK7pdo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yK_A3yK7pdo[/video]
I remember watching Keenan Allen cut ups a month ago and coming away not liking him too much, but can't for the life of me remember why. This was before I started taking notes, because I thought my brain would remember. Now I'll need to go back and watch some games of his again. I'm not interested in spending a pick on Tavon, since his skillset isn't in bread and butter WR plays. He's a luxury player for a tram like us, which lacks #1 and #2 WRs who can go vertical, and make endzone catches over DBs.. Let's get some WRs first. Patton I need to watch some games on. Zero interest in DaRick Rogers due to attitude/behaviour/drugs. As I've said, I like Bailey a lot.
We win again and we won't need to trade back. We'll be picking in the late teens up to 20th I'd think. Perfect spot for a very very good DE.
Hm. Not bad. Jordan Matthews Notes: Good hands - No one will catch him from behind once he is at full stride (though he's not a world-beater, he seems to have a great long stride once he's in the open field with only endzone in front of him) - Below avg to average at breaking tackles - Worry that he doesn;t seem to make catches in contact or when contested and battling for ball. Question mark for redzone effectiveness. Don't think he can catch fade reliably. - Great feet coming off the line, and coming out of breaks. I'd look at him in the 4th if he was still around, but I expect he goes in the top of the third. I still take Bailey over him, though I wouldn't complain about this guy.
The thing I'd point to about Stedman Bailey in the 3rd round which seems to be the popular prediction of late, is Ryan Broyles. Broyles went in the late 2nd round this year at the same exact physical dimensions as Stedman Bailey, and that was coming off an ACL tear that only happened in the November prior to the Draft. The Detroit Lions knew 2012 could very well be a redshirt and they still took him at #54 overall, at the same 5'10" and 190 lbs that Stedman Bailey is likely to measure. And it's not as if Broyles is any faster than Stedman, either. I loved Ryan Broyles immensely and when he got healthy for a brief time this year I think he was able to show why he'll end up a good pick (if he avoids injury). But one could argue that Stedman Bailey is more physical and aggressive, especially near the end zone. And he's not coming off an ACL tear.
Watched Keenan Allen vs USC. There were at least 4 occasions where Keenan Allen came open down the field and his quarterback either flat out missed him on a throw or was too late in finding him. There was one play where he ran a corner route and broke it open. However, he ended up having to float back up to his quarterback because he didn't throw the ball on his break. It would have been a big gainer had the quarterback hit him. There were two touchdowns that were missed that he was open on because of poor quarterbacking. There was another play where I believe Keenan runs a post and the quarterback throws it about 5 yards in front of him. There was only one down the field play where Allen was responsible for not coming up with the ball. He had one bad drop in this game.
As I've written, Patton reminds me a lot of Brandon Lloyd except with better character and competitiveness. I think he's a quality pass catcher.
Exactly why I want to take him in the second... though you have me concerned he may not last til the late second pick (Colts pick). Perhaps we use our highest second round pick to nab him.
It's not a year full of #1 WR's it seems. Lots of #2's to be had. Fortunately we only have 3's and 4's to begin with. lol.
Not too many notable names but great talent. Bush, Mario Williams, Santonio Holmes, D'Brickashaw Ferguson, Vernon Davis, Whitner, Ngata, Cromartie, Hali, Jonathan Joseph, Davin Joseph, Mangold in the 1st. Manning, Harper, Jennings*, Fasano , Hester, and MJD in the 2nd. Finnegan in the 7th smh
I'm sorry I meant purely looking at WRs. From that draft there was Santonio Holmes late in the 1st. and then Chad Jackson who was a combine hero and that was it. Only other notable WRs was Greg Jennings, Marshall and Colston.
To add to the discussion, I just came across a website call The College Football Experiment. This is a website that has a statistical formula to grade the wide receivers. A moneyball approach to the NFL. Anyway, this is their write up on the wide receivers in this draft. It is a little dated, from the early part of November. http://thecfx.com/2012/11/08/2013-nfl-draft-wide-receiver-prospects/ It does interest me that from a productivity perspective, Terrence Williams rivals the likes of Dez Bryant, Justin Blackmon, and Danario Alexander in the Big 12. The guy that Joe Philbin may be interested in is Jordan Matthews.
If you add it all up, Size..Hands..Yac ability.. Allen is the best imo..his hands are the best in class, ( the forgotten quality)there is good size there, and we know he can play after the catch, returning kicks at almost 6'4 is a good indicator..
I really like Terrance Williams a lot, he looks to me like the complete package. If we could get Terrance Willaims, Steadman Bailey and maybe Joseph Fauria in the 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounds respectively, I think that would be just perfect. Those 3 would add so much explosiveness and scoring to our offense.
The big reason I am turned off from Keenan Allen is the fact that he doesn't seem to separate much from the DB in his routes, he isn't great after the catch, and he doesn't seem that fast. Additionally, he isn't that physical, the first man usually gets him down and he doesn't break that many tackles. You have a big WR that doesn't seem to separate that well and isn't that fast AND the fact that he isn't that physical diminishes his value A LOT in my opinion. The most Allen will be is a possession receiver and I don't think he will be that special of a player. On the plus side, Allen has good hands and uses his body well to shield the ball from the defender, but I don't see him scaring defenses like a Terrance Williams or Tavon Austin could.
I'm a fan of Keenan Allen. He reminds me a bit of Miles Austin, who I also like. He needs coaching, which is why he doesn't always look so pretty out of his breaks or when he's just running. Has a tendency to run routes with pads skyward.
I saw Williams play a bit last night in the Baylor/UCLA game. He smoked UCLA down the left sideline, nice break off the line and deep speed. He looks pretty quick as well, but I didn't see enough to really tell. All in all, he looks like a solid WR to stretch a defense for us, could be a good fit. BTW, one thing that stood out was his propensity to just stand around at the LOS on running plays, minimal contact or effort as per the DB across from him. It just seemed kind of odd.
I'd love to get a combo of Williams, Austin, Hopkins, and Da'Rick Rodgers. That would be a huge upgrade if we can get 2 of those guys.
How many teams in the past few years have doubled up on wideouts in the draft? Would surprise me if many, considering the fear personnel men have with them.
I guess I'm giving hope we do something to upgrade the WR core if its believed Ireland doesn't go after in FA.
Only went back to 2008, but: 2008- Baltimore - Marcus Smith (rd 4), Justin Harper (rd 7) Buffalo - James Hardy (rd 2), Steve Johnson (rd 7) Chicago - Earl Bennett (rd 3), Marcus Monk (rd 7) Cincy - Jerome Simpson (rd 2), Andre Caldwell (rd 3), Mario Urrutia (rd 7) Green Bay - Jordy Nelson (rd 2), Brett Swain (rd 7) KC - Will Franklin (rd 4), Kevin Robinson (rd 6) Oakland - Arman Shields (rd 4), Chaz Schilens (rd 7) STL - Donnie Avery (rd 2), Keenan Burton (rd 4) Washington - Devin Thomas (rd 2), Malcolm Kelly (rd 2) 2009- Chicago - Juaquin Iglesias (rd 3), Johnny Knox (rd 5), Derek kinder (rd 7) Cleveland - Brian Robiskie (rd 2), Mohamed Massaquio (rd 2) Jax - Mike Thomas (rd 4), Jarett Dillard (rd 5), Tquan Underwood (rd 7) Miami - Patrick Turner (rd 3), Brian Hartline (rd 4) New England - Brandon Tate (rd 3), Julian Edelman (rd 7) NYG- Hakeem Nicks (rd 1), Ramses Barden (rd 3) Oakland - DHB (rd 1), Louis Murphy (rd 4) Philly - Jeremy Maclin (rd 1), Brandon Gibson (rd 6) Tennessee - Kenny Britt (rd 1), Dominique Edison (rd 6) 2010- Carolina - Brandon Lafell (rd 3), Armanti Edwards (rd 3), David Gettis (rd 6) Cincy - Jordan Shipley (rd 3), Dezmon Briscoe (rd 6) Houston - Trindon Holliday (rd 6), Dorin Dickerson (rd 7) Pitt - Emmanuel Sanders (rd 3), Antonio Brown (rd 6) TB - Arrelious Benn (rd 2), Mike Williams (rd 4) Tennessee - Damian Williams (rd 3), Marc Mariani (rd 7) 2011- Baltimore - Torrey Smith (Rd 2), Tandon Doss (rd 4) Cincy - AJ Green (rd 1), Ryan Whalen (rd 6) NYJ - Jeremy Kerley (rd 5), Scotty McKnight (rd 7) Oakland - Denarius Moore (rd 5), David Ausberry (rd 7) STL - Austin Pettis (rd 3), Greg Salas (rd 4) Washington - Leonard Hankerson (rd 3), Niles Pauls (rd 5), Aldrick Robinson (rd 6) 2012- Cincy - Mohamed Sanu (rd 3), Marvin Jones (rd 5) Houston - DeVier Posey (rd 3), Keshawn martin (rd 4) Indy - TY Hilton (rd 3), LaVon Brazill (rd 7) KC - Devon Wylie (rd 4), Junior Hemingway (rd 7) Miami - BJ Cunningham (rd 6), Rishard Matthews (rd 7) Minny - Jarius Wright (rd 4), Greg Childs (rd 4) STL - Brian Quick (rd 2), Chris Givens (rd 4) So based on the above, seems like you can expect at least 6 teams to take at least two WRs in the same draft. And there's at least an 80% chance that 1 team takes 3 WRs (assuming the trend holds).
Thanks Stitches. Many of those combinations are brutal and consist of later round wide receivers being the second choice.
I found the opposite. He didn;t seem to have amazing speed, just adequate speed but a great ability to eat up a DBs cushion then pick the perfect moment when the DB was flatfooted guessing Terrance's break for him to drive past him. Also, I have seen a lot of very good blocking from him.
Maybe I caught him on a few odd plays as per the blocking, I don't know. I don't think that Williams is as fast as Kendall Wright, but he seems pretty fast to me, I like his deep speed.
Yea, I imagine most teams don't take multiple high WRs because they don't often have such a dire need to invest 2 high picks, and because it seems to be such a hit and miss position. I think it's easier to justify a 2nd selection when it's rd 6 or 7 because there is a good chance those guys won't make the final 53 anyways and can be developed on the PS if they show skills. I imagine if we draft two this year it'd be one in the 1st 3 rds, and a flier on someone with tools in rd 6 or 7. However, I don't know if they feel Fuller has developed enough to forgo taking that later WR.
So many receivers that are drafted flake out... I don't see why people hate on failed picks at the wide receiver position outside the first round. This is why I'd rather invest a 2nd-3rd round pick in a wide receiver unless he looks like an elite prospect. Personally I'm holding out hope for Greg Jennings, Brian Hartline, Davone Bess (probably let him test free agency in 2014), Rishard Matthews, and a 2nd day (2nd/3rd round) draft selection in 2013.
I personally like Terrance Williams the most of the top WRs, and would be happy to get him in the 2nd rd. I'd like to see someone possibly like Justin Brown in rd 6 or 7 (assuming he runs ok) also though (someone who if they panned out could make a case to taking a roster spot, even if as the #6 WR).
