Ryan Tannehill's Running the Ball: Its Relationship With His Passing

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by shouright, Dec 22, 2012.

  1. shouright

    shouright Banned

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    [TABLE="width: 420"]
    [TR]
    [TD="width: 90, bgcolor: transparent"][/TD]
    [TD="class: xl64, width: 123, bgcolor: transparent"]
    Rushes Per Game
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl64, width: 162, bgcolor: transparent"]
    Rushing Yards Per Game
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl64, width: 107, bgcolor: transparent"]
    Yards Per Carry
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl64, width: 77, bgcolor: transparent"]
    QB Rating
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: xl65, bgcolor: transparent, align: right"] First 9 Games
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]2.3
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]3.3
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]1.43
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]71.1
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: xl65, bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]Last 4 Games
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]5
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]32.3
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]6.45
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]89.3
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="class: xl65, bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]Prior to Knee Injury (6 Games)
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]3
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]4.2
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]1.34
    [/TD]
    [TD="class: xl63, bgcolor: transparent, align: center"]76.5
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

    This does not include the Jets game away in which Tannehill barely played.

    Of course correlation does not equal causation. :)

    EDIT: Here's how the overall season shaped up, with correlations with QB rating in the bottom row:

    [TABLE="class: grid, width: 192"]
    [TR]
    [TD="width: 64, bgcolor: transparent"]
    Rushes
    [/TD]
    [TD="width: 64, bgcolor: transparent"]
    Yards
    [/TD]
    [TD="width: 64, bgcolor: transparent"]
    YPC
    [/TD]
    [TD="width: 64, bgcolor: transparent"]
    QBR
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    3
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    -4
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    -1.3
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    39
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    3
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    14
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    4.7
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    91.4
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    3
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    3
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    1
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    50.2
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    1
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    0
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    0
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    86.5
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    4
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    -4
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    -1
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    92.3
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    4
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    16
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    4
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    112
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    1
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    -1
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    -1
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    90.9
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    1
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    -1
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    -1
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    42.4
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    1
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    7
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    7
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    46.9
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    4
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    33
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    8.3
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    97.1
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    5
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    19
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    3.8
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    66.2
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    3
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    25
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    8.3
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    74.1
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    8
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    52
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    6.5
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    123.2
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    6
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    44
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    7.3
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    93.8
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    2
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    8
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    4
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    65.8
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    0.58
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    0.60
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent, align: right"]
    0.34
    [/TD]
    [TD="bgcolor: transparent"][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

    So there were fairly strong relationships between Ryan Tannehill's QB rating and both the number of times he rushed per game and the number of yards he rushed for per game.
     
  2. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    The knee injury probably has some input in this. He has been moving better of late.
     
  3. shouright

    shouright Banned

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    In the 6 games prior to the Jets game in which he hurt his knee, he rushed the ball 3 times per game, for 4.2 yards per game, and 1.34 yards per rush.

    His QB rating during that period was 76.5.
     
  4. smahtaz

    smahtaz Pimpin Ain't Easy

    That's pretty weird. I would think a rookie QB under duress would take off running by instinct, but Tannehill rarely did early on.

    Do you think it was coaching?
     
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  5. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Boomer was really, really onto something when he mentioned this a few weeks back. Numbers bear it out as well.
     
  6. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    Yeah. Just saying it has something to do. His last game was his best rushing game. Not counting last game, the previous 3 he had 4 rushes per game for 25 yards a game. Last game he took off. Maybe knee injury had small impact that's all.
     
  7. Killer Bees

    Killer Bees Bringin' the Ruckus

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    He needs to do it more often, I love his athleticism.
     
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  8. Claymore95

    Claymore95 Working on it... Club Member

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    I would take him over any QB that's going to be available in the '13 draft, and considering if we didn't take him last year we'd probably still be looking this year (unless we happened to rate Wilson higher than Seattle) then we definitely chose right.

    Edit - oops, somehow managed to reply to wrong thread!
     
  9. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    When this stuff gets harder in the playoffs, and we start facing the better teams, the ball in his hands and his ability to make plays running and scrambling, will be critical..
     
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  10. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    Would need to rewatch the games, but this could possibly be due to him extending drives which gives him more chances to hurt defenses. I'd like to know what happened on the drives where he got out and ran. Were they on average more successful than stationary pocket drives? Did the defense spy him and take a defender out of solely coverage? And did the play calls take him out of the pocket to trick the defense into biting on QB runs?
     
  11. Eop05

    Eop05 Junior Member Club Member

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    I was a little curious as to why they didn't call any designed runs the first half of the season. And it seems like he was coached to run only in absolute dire need, which I can understand to an extent.

    But you draft Ryan Tannehill partly because of his athleticism. And when you take his athleticism away, you're taking a big part of his game away and letting the defense off the hook.

    I'm glad either Ryan, himself, or the coaches are realizing his capabilities and the effect it can have on a game. And they're doing it intelligently. Calling designed runs where he slides at the first sight of danger. Smart.

    In this case, I do believe correlation equals causation. Ryan's running has had an effect on defenses which has had a positive effect on his passer rating IMO
     
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  12. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    until very recently, it's not been part of his repertoire, or built into the scheme..it hasn't been good on both counts, looked better last week, hope the more experience he gets the more it will become second nature to him..

    Still can't see how a coaching staff purposely constricts a Qb thru scheme but if that's true on some level, then maybe there's some more ceiling.
     
  13. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    IMO (opinion. means I have no empirical evidence to back this up) the coaches wrote this season off the minute Garrard got hurt. I think from there they decided this season was going to be Tannehill's training. I think this was an extended scrimmage for him.
     
  14. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That's a pretty big freakin story lol...not sure I can buy it.
     
  15. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Ok, I don't mean they purposely lost games or anything, but I think they may have approached the season with their #1 goal of getting Tannehill ready instead of the #1 goal winning the SB. Know what i mean?
     
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  16. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    Well truthfully Fin D, this season was a throw away with Garrard too. I have a hard time believing that coaches, Philbin specially, thought this was a winning roster. Garrard is a savvy veteran and all, but he is not necessarily a world beater.

    I think we'll regard Garrard's injury ultimately was a blessing in disguise, and perhaps the very best thing that could have happened for us this year. (since it opened the door for Tannehill to get his feet wet with relative very little pressure)
     
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  17. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    This roster is better than 2008's, coaching and game planning is better too.
     
  18. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I think it is either that or Tannehill had so many other things to worry about doing right that he just didn't think about running. Now that the game is slowing down he is able to use his athleticism more.
     
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  19. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, but is it a winning roster? Would Garrard playing all year make us noticeably better?
     
  20. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    2008 we went 11-5. So yes.
     
  21. shouright

    shouright Banned

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    That's my belief as well, and I think he's simply getting better at recognizing when it's better to run than to pass. Consequently his running is better, because he's now picking the right opportunities to run, and his passing is better because he's now subtracting the passing attempts he used to make that should've been runs instead.
     
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  22. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    Yeah i'm not so sure. You're giving too much credit to what Garrard would have brought. I don't think he would have been that good.
     
  23. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    We are over estimating Penny's performance. He was smart and made few mistakes but he played on a compressed field because his arm was held in place with a paper clip, a rubber band and that clear sticky stuff they use to attach gift cards to their cardboard packaging. We had to bring in the wildcat. Basically, Penny was half a really good QB that year and the WildCat was the other half. Garrard would have given us that more or less, probably a little less....but the defense is better this year.
     
  24. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    Yeah maybe. In any case, i think it worked out for the best. I would take Tannehill 1 year experience to Garrard starting and at best a first round playoff exit.
     
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  25. unluckyluciano

    unluckyluciano For My Hero JetsSuck

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    I think tanny being able to extend the play on sunday and throw the ball while running was huge. That's a veteran move IMO.
     
  26. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Yeah I totally agree. its also why I keep saying we are close.
     
  27. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    He is a pretty fluid runner too. It does not take him long to reach his stride but the thing that scares me about his running is when he slides. You can tell he's either never played any baseball or running bases just wasn't his thing. He even slightly hurt his foot when he caught it on the sod as he was sliding.

    It may seen like a minor thing but if he gets hurt sliding?
     
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  28. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Id agree with that 100%. Id go as far to assume that they didnt want him scrambling around to start the season off. Teach the kid the right way, to stand in the pocket, make a play through the air. Then, if it breaks down use your legs. You dont learn the QB position by tucking it and running for your life the second you get confused. Think your way through it, trust the gameplan, trust the playcall, trust what you read.
     
  29. finsincebirth

    finsincebirth Well-Known Member

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    Too many young QB's who are athletic play like Jake Locker. I think what the Dolphins did was try to force him to play like Aaron Rodgers instead.

    Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk 2
     
  30. shouright

    shouright Banned

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    That explains the change in the number of rushes per game, but it doesn't explain the change in the number of rushing yards per game, nor the change in the yards per carry.

    His number of rushes per game doubled, but his rushing yards per game increased by a factor of 10, and his yards per carry increased by a factor of about 4.

    If all this was only because the coaches were forcing him to play in the pocket more, those latter two numbers wouldn't have increased by a factor any greater than that of the first number.
     
  31. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    Shou, don't sacks count as rushes? He was getting sacked more earlier in the season, less so the last games. Maybe that can account for the rush attempts earlier with little yardage, and the more attempts now with 10 times more yardage. Rush attempts now are actual rushes, as opposed to sacks?
     
  32. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    :confused1:
     
  33. shouright

    shouright Banned

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    In the first 9 games he was sacked an average of twice a game. In the last 4 games he was sacked an average of once a game.
     
  34. Alex13

    Alex13 Tua Time !!! Club Member

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    no need to rely on, if we provide him some better weapons to work with though
     
  35. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    I think your trying to break the numbers down too much. Even with his rushes per game increasing, it is still a small amount of carries. B/c there are a small number of carries, 1 long run can have a huge impact on YPC.

    I think the sample size being small is allowing it to be effected more.
     
  36. RevRick

    RevRick Long Haired Leaping Gnome Club Member

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    That would not be the first time sliding has caused and injury... And there is a difference between sliding on clay and sliding on sod. It needs to be taught, as well as covering your head from the idiots that want to end your career illegally and early.
     
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  37. shouright

    shouright Banned

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    Did that one long run or runs exist?
     
  38. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    This isn't college, sacks don't count as rushing attempts or against rushing yards.
     
  39. finsincebirth

    finsincebirth Well-Known Member

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    I actually think that one slide Ozzy is taking about is when his knee brace caught in the ground on the slide in the first half. He then took the brave off in the second half.

    Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk 2
     
  40. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    I think the 20 yard run he had against the 49ers, and the 30 yard run he had against the Jags are weighing a decent amount. I think it just may be a factor of sample size right now.

    If you don't, what do you believe the reasoning is? I get the feeling that you are trying to lead the readers of the thread in a certain direction w/o coming out and saying it?
     

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