do we really need a big time defense end?

We clearly need a starting DE opposite Wake. Odrick is a nice player in the rotation, who should be in McDaniel's spot - and Tony should not even be in the rotation. Hope we draft one early.

 

It's not of the dire need it's made out to be, and finding a defensive end who fits the profile to replace Odrick on the edge in an every down sense might be a bit easier said than done.

 

I think that if a pass rusher is clearly the best player when we draft in the first, we take him, and everyone on the DL plays better because of it. However, if we can get an impact pass catcher instead, then I think that we have to go that way. Id be opposed to spending big money on a free agent with all of the other expenses that we have.

 

Are you a turtle?

 

It's a passing league. If we can't find ways to get to the passer, we are going to continue to look like Frank Gore's shirt. The upcoming draft should be top heavy in passrushers, and if a talented one falls to wherever the Fins are picking, they should/need to take them, because that kind of talent won't be around after round one. If you look at who is leading the league in sacks this year, the top 3 are all top 10 picks. It is no coincidence.

 

You can get away with Jared Odrick if you're running the right scheme. But one needs to also consider that Cam Wake isn't getting any younger. I'm not sure you prioritize it, but they shouldn't hesitate to draft one.

 

I wouldn't mind one as having two good pass rushers is great to have.

If I had a choice between upgrading the 2nd best defensive end and Kevin Burnett, I would choose Burnett.

I would like the linebackers to have a little more speed.

 

Brandon Jenkins, hurt nearly all year out of FSU. Might be a good post-first round investment. Not sure how much that injury is going to really hurt his stock though.

 

I think this is a case (as per usual) of certain individuals serially misconstruing the arguments/positions of other individuals.

I'm not sure who here has argued that defensive end is a "dire" need. It's a position that could be upgraded and that upgrade would have a number of benefits to the team's performance.

Just because there happen to be special players available that you would want to draft in the first round at that position does not make it a "dire" need. That implies that draft grades don't matter at all and the only thing that matters is taking a player at the position you need the most. I happen to like Bjoern Werner and Anthony Barr so much they would be in my short list of players at the 1st round pick. I also like Manti Te'o enough to pick him at that pick. Does that mean I also feel like MLB is a "dire" need?

This defensive end position reminds me a lot of the tight end position back in 2010. With Anthony Fasano in the fold you couldn't possibly call the position a "dire" need. Yet it was extremely incomplete, to where we had extreme waste-of-space guys like Jeron Mastrud (a rookie Mastrud, even), Mickey Shuler, John Nalbone and Dedrick Epps getting snaps there, and our lack of a second tight end (especially an athletic one) definitely affected the playbook, and both the passing and ground games. The thing about it is, it was needless to be so handcuffed. The reason they were was because they seemed to not even try to fill the position with anyone of any quality.

That's what the pass rush position looks to me like today. That's an area that could help the team get significantly better, and the fact that it's not better is a function of not trying very hard or not trying very smart, or a combination of the two. Taking and playing Olivier Vernon as a pass rushing specialist from an END position still doesn't make sense on that front. And that's why we're down to actually having Koa Misi be the second pass rushing specialist.

 

The priority has to be improving the offense unless there is such a no brainer available when we pick. If you tell me that some DE that should have been taken 6-7 picks ago in that first round is still there then maybe we have to consider it because that would mean we're looking at a top 5 talent based on our current draft position. Otherwise, offense offense offense.

 

With this front office, I could actually see them picking up a Greg Jennings and thinking that rounds out the offense into something competitive. They'd view the combination of Jennings, Hartline and Bess as a strength of the team. They'd re-sign Jake Long and keep Jon Martin at right tackle. They'd probably look for a re-boot at the guard positions (or maybe just Incognito's spot) but that wouldn't traditionally be a 1st round priority anyway, I wouldn't think. At tailback they'd just confidently go with the combination of Lamar Miller and Daniel Thomas. At tight end they'd promote Charles Clay and wait on the development of Michael Egnew.

So in that way when you say that we need to focus on the offense, I wonder if this front office is going to agree with that. In order to pay for a Greg Jennings they could be thinking they'll allow Randy Starks to walk and then plug Jared Odrick in his space. Combine that with the likely departure of Tony McDaniel and you've got room to add some DLs. For Odrick's spot they could go with just Derrick Shelby but I think they'll want to hedge their bets there.

But the corner position is in the most dire need of a total re-boot. I don't know if they're going to recognize how bad Richard Marshall was at that spot before he got hurt, but they need to. They need to also recognize that long term Nolan Carroll and Jimmy Wilson aren't providing what we need. In the end I could see a guy like Dee Milliner being the target in the 1st round.

 

*looks at giants*

Yes. More d-ends needed.

 

If they intend on beating the Pats there must be constant pressure on Tom Brady and sacks help.

 

The Dolphins pass rush is better than the Giants pass rush.

 

I've got no problem with them drafting an edge rusher high. What I'm saying is the need to do so has been blown entirely out of proportion.

The Dolphins pass rush is performing at a high level, and their methodology for doing so is not unsustainable or a "there but by the grace of God" thing. I'm a fan of taking much more inconvenient best player available choices than edge rusher, but there's a context.

 

Still better. Here's Pro Football Focus:

NYG(their game this week isn't in yet): 31 sacks, 37 hits, 115 pressures
MIA: 43 sacks, 63 hits, 134 pressures

It's worth mentioning, I'm a big fan of the Giants approach. It's just that I don't think there is evidence it's inherently better, despite my own opinion.

 

I really hope we take the FA route on a known/good/veteran WR, atleast one, and rely on later rounds/picks for the 2nd. This isnt a heavy first round caliber WR draft, so to speak. I wouldn't mind the DE or LB as stated above.

 

Every team in the league is looking for disruptive pass rushers, so in that sense, yeah we do need (another) one. I'd put WR as the #1 priority as far as team weaknesses, but rarely does the draft vibe with specific team needs so I favor getting the best players available regardless of position.

 

I've been thinking Dee Milliner is a primary target if he makes it to where we'll pick, and I certainly could see them looking at Werner if he's there also. Quite honestly, I also don't think offense will be that heavily focused on, especially if they were to pick up a Jennings or perhaps Jermichael Finley in free agency (I'm not yet convinced they're ready to bet on either Clay or Egnew). This is, after all, a defense that still doesn't contain enough crucial playmaking ability, and with extra picks in the 2nd and 3rd they could conceivably wait on a receiver or guard.

 

For what its worth PFF rates the Giants pass rush as the #16 best in the NFL and the Dolphins as #17 best.

Nobody has said that Miami has a "bad" pass rush. Normally for a team to get from #17 to the top 5 in terms of pass rush success, that team in the middle of the pack has to hit on some miracle pick like Cameron Wake. Miami's already hit on Cameron Wake though, they already have a star player. All they really need is a decent other guy and suddenly that allows you to reduce snap counts for Jared Odrick and play him at his more natural position where he can rotate actively with Randy Starks keeping both fresh and lively. I truly believe hitting on a pass rusher, and again I reiterate that "hitting" does not require he be the next Cameron Wake, would make the Dolphins' pass rush unit skyrocket up the league in terms of success and efficiency, and in turn would make the secondary look better.

Whether some people choose to portray that as me saying there's a "dire" need or that I'm blowing the pass rush need "way out of proportion" is simply a function of being argumentative.

 

Here's the thing about the Tight End position. I happen to remember back in 2009 and 2010 when it became obvious that Ireland just doesn't value the depth at the position. I think they're quietly pretty confident in what Charles Clay can do if once he steps up into Fasano's spot. And if they're not all that confident in Egnew, that doesn't mean Ireland will actually do anything about it. As I pointed out back in 2010 the Dolphins had a combo of rookie UDFA Jeron Mastrud, rookie UDFA Dedrick Epps, rookie UDFA Mickey Shuler, and failed 5th round pick John Nalbone. Those were the guys filling out the depth at the position behind Anthony Fasano. And in 2009 it wasn't better, the consistent #2 (who got 600 snaps on the year) was Joey Haynos.

So when we start to think what a Fasano-less Dolphins would look like and how much a Jeff Ireland-led front office would value the position to where they look to make a big signing or draft someone...I think you have to keep that in mind. They probably like Clay to step up to #1 in the situation that Fasano leaves, and then they have a history of not giving two ****s about what stands behind the #1.

 

That might be the understatement of the year. Outside of QB & DT our depth is nonexistent.