Trade Deadline November 1st (REVISED) Speculation Thread

Thats simply not true. Im not advocating any wr at all. Im giving you a specific wr and a reason why. And all those teams have high end wr's. Not just 1, but 2-3 at minimum. Those teams do develop their wr's but that isnt the only way to do things. We have developed Bess, Hartline who are decent 2 and 3. We still need a 1. Dwayne Bowe is a legit 1. As an addition it would save us from having to invest a high pick to get a high end wr in this years draft if we choose to pursue a contract extension at the end of the year.

I dont think a WR makes us SB contenders. It probably does help us get in to a drivers seat for a playoff spot at a minimal cost. From there who knows what happens. Im not sure we get there with the cast we have.

You also need to realize we arent differing in terms of long term philosophy. We agree on that. I think that adding a WR like Bowe short term definitely helps us get to the postseason more then sitting on your hands and doing nothing.

Also your original argument stated that Bowe was just like Marshall. I proved that incorrect both stat wise and in terms of off the field conduct. Now youre changing the argument to my football philosophy. Which one is it?

 

You just mentioned 3 teams with at least 2 receivers who are SIGNIFICANTLY better than our top 2 receivers. You're not helping your point. Hartline was our leading receiver this week with 41 yards..... last week it was Moore with 46 yards.... and the week before it was Hartline's 56 yards on 4 catches. Please stop thinking there's nothing wrong with our receivers.

 

His thinking is that all those 3 teams have all homegrown guys. What hes failing to realize is that those teams invested at least 1 early pick in getting a high end player. The NYG spent a 1st on Nicks and hit a UDFA home run with Cruz. The Pack spent a 2 on Cobb and Nelson and a 3 on Jennings. The Steelers spent a 3 on Wallace and a 1 on Miller at TE. We spent a 3 on Hartline, hit a UDFA double with Bess and traded a 4 for Fasano at TE and thats the same to him apparently.

Homegrown players are great. Got to invest high picks in them to get them oftentimes. Here we have a chance, if we see it as a fit to get Bowe possibly for not very much. That kills two birds with one stone at the cost of a late round pick. And since no one can negotiate with Bowe until years end cause hes a Franchised tagged player youre probably not looking at giving up more then a 5th. I dont see how in the world that could be a bad idea.

 

LOL at Marshall being overrated.

The Bears are 5-1...

 

6-1 after today. And the reason for that is because the Bear defense has TD's in 4 of 7 games this year (theyre 4-0) and the Bears are 2-1 otherwise with 2 wins vs the Colts and Lions (who they held to 7 points)? Marshall is the poster boy for empty stats.

 

You are advocating any WR with stats. You've provided no reason why Bowe specifically would be a plus for our team.

Your stats didn't prove they weren't the same, it proved the opposite.

Bringing in Bowe short term is pointless. He will not contribute enough this year, and next year he'd take time away from WR's we'd draft.

They are just a like. They put up similar numbers and they both have don't have the right attitude.

 

I don't see Miami being a player at the deadline. Unless an injury happens at say CB. Its easier said then done getting a trade done by the deadline.

I think they should be happy with Gaffney who had one nice deep catch and had his fingers on another.

 

Then you don't understand my argument.

I'm not saying we don't need WRs. I'm saying FA isn't the answer and more specifically, Bowe is not the answer.

 

6-1.

No empty stats with him. Dude is an excellent receiver. Doesn't belong here but he's excellent.

 

On all this trade stuff, I think you don't fix what ain't broke. This team is on an upward trajectory with what it has.

 

Please explain how any of this shows they are at all alike. If anything it proves the opposite...so far you have attempted but failed miserably to show how Bowe is anything like Marshall. Saying it is so with no factual backing does not make it so. If I was advocating any wr with stats I would have said any wr with stats. Please do not put words in my posts. Thats just trolling.

 

I don't fail to realize that. i do realize that.

This regime has had all of one off season together. I said before the draft WR was the least important of our current needs. People lost their **** over that, but its true. We had a bunch of needs and WR was one of them, but it was below many other positions like QB & OL. I think this coming off season we'll get our WRs and I think it will be through the draft. We don't need to panic and grab Bowe. Again, you zero in on Bowe, not because he's Bowe, but because he's the best guy you'll think is available. That tells me right there, its not a move that needs to be made.

 

Those stats are the ones you're using? Why not these other ones you posted, you know, the ones that actually show their individual stats.

You remember, it was in the post you made explaining that they were not all that different.

 

Im not dragging the regime in to this because that would change the argument from you for a 3rd time. I zeroed in on Bowe because as I mentioned about 4 or 5 posts ago we needed SIZE, especially in the redzone where we simply dont not convert enough TD's. While I did stress the need for a #1 WR, it was also highlighted that our leading wr's the last 3 games havent eclipsed 50 yards. And with the Pats (2x) the Bills (who dont defend the pass either but can score) the Titans (see Bills) and Seahawks (great corners) we need wr's who can make plays. Bowe kills both birds with one stone at a potentially low cost.

You zero in on Bowe as a panic move, I do not. If we give up a 2nd rounder its a panic move but Ive never advocated that and in fact said I wouldnt do that. I was talking about a 5th round or later pick which is just the opposite of a panic move....its move of a see if we can catch lightning in a bottle move with a pick that often times amounts to nothing anyway

I didnt use those stats because the other better illustrates my point that Bowe's success was tied to KC winning their division and disproved your theory that Bowe's stats were empty just like Marshall's. But clearly you are ignoring those stats because its convenient for you rather then actually acknowledging their significance. It is you who simply looked at raw number. Additionally the first set of stats was in a discussion with Fin-o who claimed Marshall was better then Bowe which is why I posted the raw cumulative stats as opposed to the set of stats I posted in response to your argument.

You are simply reaching at straws to hold on to your theory which is silly to begin with. You cant sit there and say that there is a finite amount of players that you can get through FA/trade and that the rest have to be homegrown because there are many recipes for success. I learned long ago that tying yourself in to one specific theory isnt the way to go. FA/trades shouldnt be your primary way to improve your team but it can certainly be used, as it was intended, to get supplemental pieces which is what im advocating Bowe as.

 

Does anyone from the Bengals defense make sense with connections with Coyle? Research on my phone is a pain in the butt, but I would prefer a defensive trade with someone that Coyle knows well.

 

Based on watching football and not googling #'s.

 

I'm not changing the argument.

I said Bowe won't be good in this offense. I said he won't flourish for the same reasons Marshall wouldn't flourish and that they are the same player. They both have attitude issues and they are both overrated. Their stats are more or less the same. They bring and don't bring the same things to the table.

We don't need size as much as we need speed and route running ability with sure hands.

Trading for Bowe is the definition of a panic move.

Using those stats in the context of our argument makes no sense. You're using team statistics to try and prove two individuals are alike or similar. That doesn't jive at all.

Um yeah, the only one reaching is you. Think about it.

You think we need Bowe because....he's taller than our current WRs and he's nothing like Marshall in spite of their similar stats and the fact they cause both their teams headaches....all because their teams had different records.

I am saying, we don't need Bowe because he won't fit the mold we need. He'll be a disruption and I don't think this coaching staff will put up with his whiny foolishness. That's far from reaching.

 

We need another TE and a good CB. Perhaps DE if someone is available? But that won't happen...I hope we sit on our picks and look forward to a strong and bountiful draft!

 

i absolutely want him on our team, i was hoping we sign him in the offseason

 

I would rather see the Dolphins continue to build through the draft. I really don't see anyone who might be available right now who can come in and make an immediate impact this season. The Dolphins have the salary cap and plenty of draft picks in 2013 to seriously upgrade some of their areas of need. They are playing well enough right now to stick with the players they now have on the roster.

My view is that 2013 will be the year this team jumps into the top tier teams in the NFL. Trading a high round draft pick at this time for a player another team is trying to get rid of just doesn't make much sense, IMO.
If I thought a player or two would make the Dolphins a SB team this year, I could see the need to try and make a blockbuster trade right now. I just don't see the Dolphins as a legitimate SB contender this year, but I can certainly see them contending next year if they hit on some of their high draft picks and a free agent or two in the off season.

 

The trade deadline has been moved back to Thursday at 4 PM Eastern.

 

Still dont expect pricetags to be met.....limited activity to me....wish it was moved to week 10 really....glad they moved it from 6 to 8, but really think it should sit at Tues 4pm following week 10 games.

 

I think the deadline should be between weeks 12 and 13.

 

I understand the attraction of getting Bowe, if we only had to spend a fourth rounder to do so. He could still learn enough of the offense to be helpful in the December stretch run to the playoffs (yes, playoffs). The issue with drafting a WR next year? Well, a couple things actually. First, we will be drafting toward the middle of the round, even in the 20's if we make the playoffs as a wildcard. We won't get an stud WR without giving up at least a third or probably second (to move up) for one of the top guys. Second, you don't expect a rookie WR to come in and make much of an impact. You anticipate he will start hitting his stride during his second season.

That means even if we go WR in the first round, we should expect no drastic improvement in the WR corp until 2014. I would guess we look at getting a #1 vet WR and then draft a second rounder or so to develop in 2013. Then we can truly contend next year, and still be building for the future with the draft.

BTW, Cook sounds like a good trade, if we can get him for fourth and sixth round picks. Maybe one of our thirds, the Bears' pick will be very late in the round anyway.

 

Go into this with an open mind is all I say. I am sure Ireland will do that?

 

If you think about it,we're still pretty thin in the secondary. Giving up those big chunks of yards the whole second half of yesterdays game can attest to that.
Not sure there is anyone out there that can help us now and stay with us after the season.

 

Unless there is a CB available, I wouldn't make a move right now. This team is playing very well and CB might be our only go to need position.

 

Philbin's offense does just fine with late 1sts and 2nd round WRs. Look at Green Bay.

As fans, we HAVE to switch our expectations, because we are going to be a team that grows its own talent. That's just the way it is going to be, so embrace it.

 

If KC is truly entering fire sale mode...I'd be damned interested in Tamba Hali. Hali + Wake would hands down be the best DE combo in the league. I know Hali had a substance abuse suspension, so alot might ride on that alone - and I'm sure KC would want a pretty penny - so its extraordinarily unlikely - but holy ****. Thinking about it gets me moist, as unrealistic as it may be.

 

Not that I don't embrace that philosophy, but how do we know this to be true?

 

Its what Philbin knows. His entire pro career has been at GB, and Ireland has proven he's willing to adapt to Philbin and consult him when a move is available.

 

Right but we don't know if that's something Philbin fully subscribes to. He didn't have personnel control in Green Bay.

I'm not objecting to that philosophy. I'm objecting to speaking in absolutes when it comes to potential personnel/FO strategy. It's nothing more than conjecture.

 

I don't want to trade for anybody.Save our draft picks and build our team the right way.

 

Jared Cook is someone you might not be able to get in the draft. He's arguably the perfect player for Miami since he allows you to threaten the seam making Hartline and Bess that much more effective. The Pats with Welker, Hernandez, Branch, and Gronk aren't very different in total team speed but they're very effective together. The offense would flat out take off.

 

I'm pretty sure Coyle was calling the defensive coverage a little conservative in later the second half to bleed out the clock. I'm not too worried about it.