Who put a gun to your head and even asked you to watch it? It was on ESPNews at 9:00 on a Friday night. Was there nothing else going on in NYC at that time, on a weekend that you could have filled your time with? And he didn't actually predict anything. He just said he didn't come to Miami to win one championship. Yeah, he mugged for the crowd, big deal. Less embaressing than amare Stoudemire pretending to be Jewish because he moved to NY.
Well championships are ultimately a team accomplishment. Jordan refused to continue playing when Phil Jackson retired. But I have a hard time saying he's better than someone like Kareem, who won 6 championships, but was able to do it with multiple teams.
People were calling him the biggest FA for years prior to last summer. Him marketing himself was just giving the fans what they wanted. The only time it became a negative was when he chose the Miami Heat, by fans of teams he rejected. I never heard any criticism of him being marketed prior to that.
? You are changing the argument again. LeBron and The Decision (which he willingly hyped and took part it) made him into the target he is today. Complaining about how much press and scrutiny he gets is silly because he is the one who willingly placed that pressure on himself. You are trying to project another argument onto me that isn't what we were discussing at all.
The level of Lebron hate is far from rational. The Decision was primarily a creation of ESPN. Depending on your POV it is evidence of his "arrogance" or evidence that he wanted to raise money for his charity. The comments at the introduction could be considered mugging for the camera or arrogance again depending on your POV. Even if it is arrogance, I don't see it as any worse than MJ's arrogance throughout his career or Larry Bird's either. I still recall Bird asking before the 3-point competition (I think it was the first one) "who do you think is going to be second?" IMO Lebron giving up millions in salary and joining another superstar knowing that his numbers would be down and knowing that everyone would question whether he is "the man" shows far less arrogance than most superstars ever did. He stated all along that he was about winning championships and proved that by following the blueprint that history has shown leads to championships. The people who criticize the Heat for combining three superstars are just ignorant of or purposefully ignoring the history of the league. As for this last game, Lebron played poorly. He lacked aggression on offense and he struggled on defense. He made some nice passes (and good decisions), but also had too many turnovers. He acknowledged that his play was "inexcusable". That being said, he's been Miami's best player throughout the year and throughout the playoffs. People want to pretend that Lebron is somehow not a superstar b/c he had a bad game in the playoffs. However, the players we all consider superstars all had their bad games as well. One of MJ's bad playoff games was already mentioned in this thread. I know Bird had two playoff games where he was limited to 8 points. Magic had a bad game in the finals that resulted in the headline "Tragic Johnson". People keep saying that they don't remember MJ (or whatever superstar comparison they're using) ever disappearing in a big spot, but that's just evidence of their poor memory rather than evidence that it didn't happen. The fact is that over time our memories become selective. That's why things were almost always better during the good old days. But that's not a rational or reasonable standard. People forget that MJ (just like Lebron) didn't win a championship his first 7 years. People were saying that MJ couldn't lead his team to a championship. (that changed when he was part of three superstars and a year after they added Phil Jackson as the HC) Obviously those people were proven wrong, but they were just as adamant in their opinions as Lebron's critics are today. And I expect that in retrospect today's critics will also end up being proven equally wrong.
Then why don't you trash Wade and Bosh for not doing the same? Aren't they traitors for not living up to their "responsibility" and "obligation" to the NBA?
Only the #1 FA had the draw to be on a show like that. That's why ESPN set it up and why it was proposed to Lebron and only Lebron.
I don't hate lebron, or think the decision was all that narcissistic. Having said that the man makes tons of money off the media and went through with being involved on the decision. He is no where near innocent in this and he is no victim of the media. You can't use the media then claim to be a victim of it, come on now.
Because people didn't care about them as much as LeBron. I'm not aware of any websites devoted to bringing Bosh to Cleveland or Chicago. Only site I can think of that was close was the one Miami made for Wade. Surely, if Wade or Bosh had an hour long special, it would not have gotten ratings higher than the 08 NBA Finals.
I never said the journalists were right either. But no ones on here saying the media are victims of lebron are they?
Ok, rumor going around Rashard Lewis is having his way with LeBron's lady and hence the reason he looked distracted. I can't emphasize the word "rumor" more strongly.
I don't believe in victims in most cases or this one in particular. I just think that the fans and media who are criticizing Lebron are not being rational or reasonable in their criticism. I know I have stated that several times. I have never said poor Lebron is a victim.
cocky |ˈkäkē| adjective ( cockier , cockiest ) conceited or arrogant, esp. in a bold or impudent way. I fail to see the distinction. It sounds like just another irrational way to say I like one person so what he does is okay, but I dislike another so when he does the same thing it's not okay.
Basically it's a difference of perception from the fan that requires no factual basis. In other words, if you like a player he's cocky, if you don't he's arrogant.
I think you are misunderstanding where I am coming from, I am not making the arguement that LeBron is arrogant but what Bird did was not, I was a Bird fan since watching him when he was at Indiana State and there was nothing he did on the court that was ever arrogant, you can make the case Lebron is not but the example you brought up was not a good example, for one Bird never talked a big game for the things that mattered, the 3-point contest was a gimmick and as much as Bird wanted to win it he knew it was an indivdual event, something he was never about, he was always about the team.
MJ never disappeared in the six finals series they won. Did he shoot less than 50% in some of those games? Sure, but disappear, as in fail to take shots? nope. Also, you state three superstars in Chicago once PJ got there, Jordan... Pippen... who was the third?
So, when he passed the ball to B.J. Armstrong and John Paxson for game winners and averaged I think over 6 assists a game, he was doing it all himself? he facilitated enough, and in some big time situations as well. To say he didn't is not accurate IMO.
Didn't Des tell you, he's really a real estate agent; hence why he's all about location, location, location. In all seriousness, I had a big argument with my wife's cousin. He's a huge SFLA sports fan, and thought the Heat would win it all. My caveat to him was that LeBron seems to quit, shy away from the spotlight many times in big situations. He may just not have that 'killer instinct', now granted the guy is young, and that can grow in you as you get older - see Nowitski for proof of that. Dirk has certainly matured into a more cut throat player, but to me right now, thats not LBJ, thats Wade, but not LBJ. Not yet.
The dude scored 25 straight points in an ECF game 5 against the Pistons as a 21 year old. He definitely has "killer instinct".
He's also disappeared more times than he's been the guy in those moments. Do you disagree with that? Wade has a killer instinct, LBJ does not.
Considering how your Celtics got knocked out of the playoffs this year, you’re not really the one who wants to broach this topic.
Why is that exactly? Wouldn't that tell you I've seen him for a few years in big moments? Yes, he did get past the Celtics - 1 for 3 ain't bad, if you're a hitter in baseball.
No one ever had to ask Kobe, Jordan, Kareem, Magic, Bird, Isiah, etc to be involved. No one. People have asked that of LBJ more than a few times.
Rarely does he show up either. The guy's a good player, but he ain't a closer to me. Kobe; he'll close your *** out. LBJ? I'd still worry more about Wade.
Yes he does. Problem is, the media hypes up players who overrated like Kobe, but down plays Lebron. Lebron is much more clutch than Kobe.
You mean aside from Kobe having 5 rings. Yeah the guy with no rings is more clutch than the guy with 5. But I'm the one with no facts. So other than because you say so, what fact do you have? Just because he moved south doesn't make him more clutch than a 5 time champion.
Rings? Really? You cannot be serious. Rings prove nothing. Also, he didn't get one against Lebron. I have these facts. http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/trueh...t=haberstroh_tom&page=KobeLeBronclutch-101222 Yea, Kobe has the high lite reel game winners. But lebron is in fact more clutch than Kobe. The media just says otherwise, and has people believing that Kobe is more clutch when thats false.
If Wade can't go, this series may be quite different. Thats stating the obvious, ofcourse, but damn thats big if he can't go. He's a tough SOB too.
