Ok I know this sounds crazy and will catch a TON of flack but.....

I don't know that you'll catch a ton of flack.

What I do know is that a ton can change between now and next April, so I don't feel comfortable giving an opinion on what our holes or needs will be (and whether we'd be in position to make such a trade or if it'd even be worth it). I do think Luck in general would be worth trading all 7 picks for though if you thought he was going to be Manning.

 

I am still a firm believer that Quarterback will NOT be our biggest need next draft. Sure call me a homer, call me a dumb ***, I don't care. I still believe in Henne. I think the offense he was forced and coached to run his entire PRO career has been ridiculous, vanilla, boring, opposite of his strengths etc. So I will refuse to judge him, or our needs for next year, until I see this year play out.

He has been leading (with Jake Long) unofficial work outs, he has re-gained the trust of his number 1 WR, he has been given more weapons.....last season he had NO RUNNING GAME, he dealt with a Diva receiver and a out of touch offensive coordinator, and to be honest.....last year was his first, entire year as the starter.....so unlike 90% of this board, and the entire Miami Dolphin fan base, I refuse to act like Chad Henne is some no-body has-been, until he has received a fair shake.

 

I am in agreement, SICK.

 

I disagree with Sick. The offense he has been asked to run are well within his strengths. He was not good enough to take the team beyond how good they are when injuries set in. One thing that has been pointed out over and over again is that Miami had one of the worst starting position in the NFL. If memory serves me right, for half of the year Miami was close to leading the league in yards, yet could not score points. Part of the problem was the offense and another part was Henne was not a good redzone quarterback. The time the team fell apart was injuries really set in and Henne is not Rogers. He needs a line that can protect him because his pocket presence is so poor.

If Edmond Gates can help with field position and Henne improves his game more than a baby step and the line doesn't crash due to all of the starters getting injured, then Miami will not have enough firepower to even sniff Luck.

 

If henne turns in a repeat performance of last season, I think we have to move strongly to get Luck. I think others will drive up the trade price, though.

I'd gladly give up a rising star in Cam Wake (hoping he leads the league in sacks), plus our entire dang draft to get Luck.

 

There is no guarantee Luck will even be there. He doesn't have to declare this year if he so chooses. It be 2013 before he's a draft eligible prospect.

 

There were so many QB's drafted this year that next year there may not be such a market for Luck (as far as trading for the pick goes). Also, Miami's team age is pretty young IMO and may be able to absorb losing quite a few picks for a year or two in order to trade up for Luck. Hey, maybe Miami will be in the fortunate (unfortunate?) position to trade up from a late first to get Luck. However, if Miami makes the playoffs with Henne and the young team, the GM will be hesitant to trade all for a QB and the dissaray that will cause with the QB battle and team that has matured with Henne and know his style.

 

I'm in agreement with Alen who's in agreement with Sick.

 

Henne was NOT a bad redzone QB. Your description is not accurate Dupree. If Henne was a poor rezdone QB then so was half the league including Drew Brees. Please dont confuse "not having many TDs because you're opportunities are limited" with "not being good in the redzone".

Rewatch the first half of the season and see how many passes were dropped. See how many TDs were missed b/c the receiver couldn't hold onto the ball, get his foot in bounds, or not run out of bounds then come back in. Watch how many INTs occurred b/c receivers fell down or half-arsed the play. Pay attention to INTs that occurred after receivers dropped key passes that left Henne in 3rd and long (see Cobbs dropping a perfectly thrown wheel route that hits him in the numbers, leading to an INT on 3rd & 10 two plays later <also thanks to the ground game running for no yards>). Pay attention to HOW MANY drives were killed or stalled because the ground game stalled it.

Seriously, is Henne supposed to do EVERYTHING? Does it not matter to you that our ground game is supposed to account for some of our production? (you know-- since we're a running team and all). I could empathize with you if we're talking about 1 game where the ground game was ineffective and Henne couldn't pick up the slack, but we're not; we're talking an entire season of Henne being asked to pick up the slack without the proper resources to do so, including OC & playcalling. If you want to put all the pressure on Henne and expect him to succeed, then give him the resources and an OC who doesn't cut him off at the wrists. It blows my mind that you think any QB can carry a run-oriented offense on his shoulders with Henning as the OC while playing behind a dismantled OLine & 6 practice squad guys at WR & TE. You act as if we're a team built to pass and Henne was in the perfect situation to throw 50 times per game.

We were a league leader in yards while not finishing drives because HENNE would drive the team down the field doing much of the work, and then Henning would revert to a useless wildcat play or run for negative yards. It's slightly difficult for a QB to finish a nice drive (that he was mostly responsible for) when he's not given the opportunity to do so.

Enough with this "Henne is not Rodgers" bull doodie. Rodgers didn't have injuries all across his entire offense like Henne. I guess Peyton Manning is "no Aaron Rodgers" either because he sure as heck went 1-4 with 13 INTs during 5 games when the same thing happened to him.

And his pocket presence isn't poor. It's average, and it improved as the year went on. It's also difficult to have mobility in the pocket with a sprained knee.

 

You did a great job of saying nothing to prove me wrong.

Also henne's pocket presense is not average. Just shows your bias, my friend.

 

I'm not biased; I just rewatched the first 8 games before his injury. I don't see a player with poor pocket presence; I see one with average presence.

 

Todd the last 5 games may have you thinking otherwise.

I'm not a Henne basher. I'm ok with him getting another chance under better circumstances. But everytime I rewatch the Detroit game, I feel like he will never ever get it.

I'm as neutral as I guess I can be...he has looked like Ryan Leafs cousin at times, but I just am not ready to close the book on him just yet.

As for Luck? Unless we get the #1
pick by sucking then we are going to have to sell the farm and then some to move up. I guess were all in with Henne wich to me is the equivalent of Queen Ten of Spades.


Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

 

I'm not judging anyone on our offense over the last 5 games except for the practice squad players & backups "trying" to make a name for themselves. Ricky & Ronnie had already been judged prior to then.

 

You also saw a hartline that should have broken up a pass that was running at full speed and a ball that is five yards behind him. I do not trust your scouting ability.

 

I know, I'm just saying you will see a different Chad Henne here soon.



Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

 

Considering it's Hartline, you're right---- I probably shouldn't expect him to break up the pass. Just because countless other receivers around the league can make that play on a pass where his QB has a sprained knee and a defender in his face, it's wrong for me to expect the same from Brian.

 

If Henne fails then we don't have a QB. QB then is our number 1 need and I would trade my draft for Andrew Luck. Boom franchise QB for the next 13+ years.

 

If Henne ends up having a bad season and what ever vet we pick up stinks it up as well ... we might not have far to move up in the draft to take anyone next season

 

<light bulb> Here's a novel idea that Dolphin fans would hate--- Henne has a solid season, takes us to the playoffs, and allows us to draft the best defensive player on the board while freeing up our 2013 first rounder in the process.

 

Why would we hate that?

 

---Because half the fan base seems excited about watching Henne hypothetically fail so they can draft another QB next year. There seems to be a little too much enthusiasm regarding the "what if Henne sucks arse next year" mumbo jumbo. If I didn't know better, I'd think he were a NY Jet the way fans talk about him.

 

No one is excited about Henne failing. We all just realize Henne was not very good last season, and that may end up happening again. So we take interest in the crop of quaterbacks who may be entering next season's draft.

 

Even if we wanted Luck next draft and offered our entire compliment of picks to move up, the team holding the #1 overall will likely want him too and won't trade out for any offer. When it comes to draft day trades it always takes two to tango.

 

Getting tired of the "Suck for Luck" mindset too?

 

if you select what games to "judge" your conclusions are biased. You must take the entire body of work. why aren't you looking at the last 5 games?

 

There are zero receivers who can do that because none of them can defy the laws of physics. The Flash would be able to.

 

I would love that. In fact I would love it if Henne has a great season.

It is telling that Henne's most strongest supporter can only imagine Henne having a solid season.

 

yes.

 

I didn't pick and choose games at random. Excluding the last 5 games is actually the opposite of being biased. People who want to judge Henne on the last 5 games are the biased ones. You have it backwards my friend.

You must take the entire body of work huh? Sorry if I disagree. Sorry if I want to judge a player off the norm of the situation rather than the exception to the norm. Do you make it a habit of judging a player's performance when he's injured, is playing with injured players, and is playing in a position requiring chemistry between he and his players despite having 6 practice squad guys and a veteran fresh off the street? Do you make it a habit of judging a position whose performance is directly impacted by the predictable coordinator calling the plays who was fired at the end of the season? I can keep going if you like. Do you make it a habit of judging a player who's forced into a role that the offense wasn't designed for? Do you make it a habit of judging a QB who played in a system designed for another QB of a different skill set?

Would you judge Peyton Manning during the 5 games he played during the middle of last season where he performed miserably because his offense was injury plagued?...... or would you judge Peyton based off his body of work before it? I rest my case.

 

You're right. It's impossible for a receiver to plant his right foot and drive back to the ball when he has 50 yards of air time watching it to do so. <sarcasm>
We're not talking about a 7 yard out here. He didn't assess the under throw quick enough just as he's similarly had trouble tracking other longer passes.

He gradually slowed down and took a BUNCH of short steps before he realized he needed to make a play on the pass. He was letting the throw come to him rather than actually attacking it. There was ZERO immediacy to his effort whatsoever. Not every pass can be dropped right in the bucket; there are defenses getting paid to try and stop that sort of things. Under those circumstances, the receiver needs to step up and earn his money. If Hartline could effectively make plays downfield, we wouldn't have Edmund Gates in here.

 

That's what optimistic people do after a season where EVERYTHING on offense fell apart, yet the QB hung in there and is working harder than anyone in the league to get himself and his guys prepared to succeed.

I watched 3 games in a row from Matt Ryan besides what I watched during the regular season. If Henne sucks, then Ryan needs to be replaced, too, because he's no more of an impressive passer than Henne.

Matt had a ground game that massively helped him out (lots of solid yardage on 1st & 2nd down and 10+ yard runs to keep a defense honest).
He had an aggressive OC who did a heck of a job calling plays and did NOT take the ball out of his hands or play for FGs.
I saw Ryan miss as many (or as few) passes as Henne.
I saw Ryan overthrow 2 wide open receivers streaking down the field (the only 2 35+ yard passes he attempted in those 3 games).
I saw off target passes being completed that similarly thrown passes by Henne were either dropped or INT'd.
I saw numerous passes batted down at the line (however not INT'd in the process).
I saw him getting sacked in a similar immobile fashion as Henne.
I saw a similar amount of poorly placed throws.
I saw a QB who had considerably better protection.
I saw less passes of a higher degree of difficulty.
I didn't see receivers falling down or having passes bounce off them into defenders hands.
I saw just as many if not more check downs.

 

If you want to give Henne the benfit of the doubt Im all for it, but please dont start comparing him to Matt Ryan!? Dont do that to yourself Todd.

 

[video=youtube;TERnwoqnmLk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TERnwoqnmLk&feature=related[/video]


Ok seriously, watch the entire video, this guy isnt far removed from any of these throws, even the college ones. The first 2 throws of the video, are down the field, with touch, and touchdowns everytime if thrown to marshall. LET THE GUY THROW!!!!

 

Anyone else notice alot of those throws from 2009 were off playaction? Any coincidence our running game was one million times better in 2009 than 2010? Just saying.....

 

^^Thanks for the video. Had to turn the sound off though. I can't see why anyone thinks adding rap for background noise does anything to improve a video.

 

Fact is there is still a question of whether Henne can be the Miami Dolphins franchise quarterback. Until he answers it, don't fault fan's for wanting to get one.

 

Two videos I put together of his throws against Cleveland. First time I ever did videos so they look pretty crappy but here it is anyways. Some throws are good, some are bad but note the play design too please.

[video=youtube;9HQ1PKNvfuY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HQ1PKNvfuY[/video]
[video=youtube;zPMBdSkFkyc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPMBdSkFkyc[/video]