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Would u Accept Michael Sam

Discussion in 'NFL Draft Forum' started by dolfan40, Feb 22, 2014.

  1. dolfan40

    dolfan40 Well-Known Member

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    If we draft him? In a Interview today he said: If the Miami Dolphins drafted me, I would be excited to be a part of that organization."
     
  2. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    If he's there in the 5th-6th round it would be a nice value pick but I won't waste more on that when we have many other needs. We are knee deep in pass rushers.

    He won't be there though so no point talking about it.

    If the question is would I accept him because he's gay - I don't care what these guys are into (as long as everyone they're into is at the legal age). As I said in the first Michael Sam thread, him being gay does nothing to win games on Sunday, and it really is irrelevant. Good for him. Once people stop putting gays in a pedestal it won't be much of a topic anymore. The topic is very obnoxious.
     
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  3. Silverphin

    Silverphin Well-Known Member

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    As I said before, the only reason why I would be against him drafting is because we're stack at DE as it is. If it wasn't for that, I'd be all for drafting him.
     
  4. Claymore95

    Claymore95 Working on it... Club Member

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    Yes, but not in the first 3-4 rounds as he's not playing a position we need to draft highly. Rounds 5-7, sure, would be a good add.

    As for "accept", and I assume you mean because he's gay, then yes, no problem at all.
     
  5. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    There's a 20+ page thread on him in the Miami forum. Do we need another one?
     
  6. UCF FINatic

    UCF FINatic The Miami Dolphins select

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    Accept him? Yes. Do I want him? No.

    Reason being it would create a Tebow like distraction. I think had Tebow not had all the fanfare he would be a 2nd or 3rd string QB somewhere in the NFL. There is a problem created though when your starter isn't performing well and you have a cult hero on the bench, the fans start calling for him even though he doesn't give you the best chance to win. Additionally, lets say you take him in the 5th or 6th round and he comes in and doesn't perform that well in training camp if you have to cut him it would be a PR mess where you would have to explain why, etc.

    I'd personally just stay away from the situation all together to be honest. That being said, I could easily see Ross telling Hickey to make sure we get him...
     
  7. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    I do not believe having him on the team would be a Tebow like distraction. But unless Jordan gets officially moved to LB, or gets traded, or unless the coaches believe Sam would make a good LB and planned to play him there, Sam really does not play a position of great need. We have Wake, Vernon, Jordan, and even Derrick Shelby who can get extended snaps and hold his own out there. It's our deepest position.
     
  8. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    I don't believe the distraction angle. IMO that's a minor inconvenience. And arguably it could even provide some positive PR. My only issue is about the position need. If we had a big FA that filled most needs (unlikely) than I'd be fine with addressing the position on a BPA basis depending on what else is available. His sexual orientation is a non-issue.
     
  9. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    This whole issue is ridiculous. He just isn't that good.

    If he were a first day prospect, maybe some hoopla, but, this kid may not even get drafted.

    You want a bargain DE/OLB on draft day. Draft Tyler Starr, not Michael Sam.http://itiswhatitis.weei.com/sports...uld-be-under-the-radar-prospect-for-patriots/

    Why risk offending players on your team?? Do you really think that out of 53 guys and the reserve lists and practice squad, and a number of coaches and trainers, in the most brutal team sport in existence that their aren't some seriously prejudice people????

    How naive can you get?

    Of course everybody is saying the right thing. If you don't say the politically correct thing in regard to homosexuality these days you are a hair away from being prosecuted for a hate crime.

    Openly gay NFL football players will cause tension in the organization. Practical thinking people know this. That is why nobody hired Kerry Rhodes last year, and Kerry Rhodes is one of the better safeties in the league, a proven commodity.

    The GM who drafts Sam will be looking to make a social statement or he is an idiot, and there are few GM's who would fit just fine playing either of those roles.

    Ya, I think he will get drafted, and ya, I think it will cause problems but I doubt anybody will ever here about what the situation really is.

    It would be suicide in today's America to publicly speak out about any problems. It would take way more courage for a player to, come out, publicly against gay players in the NFL than it did for Sam to, come out, especially considering Sam was, for all intents and purposes already out. People who are trying to be discrete don't dance around half naked in public night clubs.

    Sam is definitely not the kind of high character leader type guy the Dolphins really need.

    If Hickey drafts him he would definitely fit into the idiot category.
     
  10. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    So did the younger and even less mature Mizzou players say the right things or did it just seem like they said the right things. *rolleyes*
     
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  11. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    I hope the national media doesn't think Miami fans are homophobic because of all the orange seats. Just in case any media members read this thread, that's called a regular season without Dan Marino.
     
  12. NUGap

    NUGap Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    If you put the randomly bolded words together, does it form some kind of secret message? Let's see: Tyler Starr Will Against Not.

    Nope, so really there's no redeeming quality to this post other than general ignorance.

    In other news Jason Collins, an openly gay basketball player, got on the court for Brooklyn tonight. Not only did the world not explode, they won! Gasp! What a concept. You mean a gay man didn't cause so much dissension in a locker room that the team literally ceased to exist. Color me amazed.
     
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  13. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    Ya, no points,2 rebounds, and 5 fouls in 11 minutes. A ten day contract for a 35 year old retired center.

    Tell me that it is nothing but a farce done to make a social statement.
     
  14. NUGap

    NUGap Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    His production is irrelevant. He played. He defended guys in the post. Presumably he showered after the game with the team. No problems.

    This preoccupation by fans, media, and NFL personnel people with "distractions" is ridiculous. The whole game of football is a big-*** distraction from the real world. That doesn't mean don't get invested in your team as a fan, but let's be honest - this is all just entertainment anyway, let's spice it up - spit in the face of what works for a "conventional" locker room. You think people who succeed and teams that win have boring, conventional outlooks on their process? No, they try new things and bring in new ideas, new people. Sam might not be your guy - I think he's a one trick pony personally. But I'm all for abandoning these traditional football outlooks on what works. It's all just entertainment anyway.
     
  15. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    His production is irrelevant???????

    Are you even a sports fan??

    I think you just made your own posts irrelevant. Perhaps they should be sent to the irrelevant forum in the future.
     
  16. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    less of a social statement than you're making with this crap.
     
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  17. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I wold expect him to welcome the challenge, when everyone else has been saying he's a bad fit he speaks up and says it doesn't mean #### to him.im taking him in the fourth round and I don't care if he is a backup.

    That dude is made up of all the stuff this team and culture needs.
     
  18. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    IMO the locker room is much less homophobic than the rest of the country. The over-riding principal is "can he play?" Are there prejudiced people in the locker room? Sure, but those prejudices take a back seat to "can he play?". The same thing happened when blacks started playing in the NFL. All the prejudice was less important. It will be the same thing with any prejudice now, probably even less since there is much less prejudice among the younger generations and football skews younger.
     
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  19. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    You're changing the argument.

    The premise is that a gay person would cause too much distraction for a team to win. His team won, so now you make the argument about his quality of play. That's changing the argument.
     
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  20. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    I am always about the team, I dont care about stories.....

    Bottom line if it makes sense and the round is right, do it. Provided the scouts see that there is talent there...
     
  21. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Smart response, given the circumstances, bet it was real, and I'm sure he would welcome the challenge.
     
  22. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I don't think that is necessarily true.

    I don't necessarily want to make this about race but I consider it more racist to find yourself afraid to talk about racial culture than it is to talk about racial culture so I'll go ahead.

    The NFL is overwhelmingly black. Just a simple fact. The culture is much more aligned with black culture than other racial cultures.

    There are some very distinct signs and realities about black culture being more hostile toward homosexuals than white culture. In fact, there is evidence and even stated doctrine from various conservative think tanks like ALEC that they have targeted this phenomenon as a means of trying to drive a wedge between the black populace and liberals. The black population has voted overwhelmingly liberal for a long time. This is a known phenomenon.

    Hip hop culture is rife with acceptable gay slurs being tossed around easily and freely. That's one issue a gay player will have to deal with in an NFL locker room.
     
  23. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    Well... he's small, weak, and slow...

    ...and we're stacked at the position already.


    No thanks. No amount of character is worth taking a guy that won't be able to produce on the field.
     
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  24. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    Sam has not looked good in the combine. 4.91 official 40. 17 reps in the bench. He just recorded only a 25 1/2 vertical jump. That's pretty underwhelming.
     
  25. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    The problem with this is he's the SEC Defensive Player of the Year. If there weren't so many other things going on with him then there would always be a cadre of people speaking up loudly about how stupid it is that the SEC Defensive Player of the Year is being maligned so much based on some numbers from the "underwear olympics".

    But I don't sense that bloc of support with him.
     
  26. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    What's the obsession with that award though? It seems to have gone to a player who's production wasn't even that impressive? It all came in 3 games that were teams that were against teams that weren't great competition. IMO, it's seems like this award is all he has going for him.
     
  27. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    That award...and the 11.5 sacks, 19.0 TFLs, 2 FFs, 5 Hurries and 1 TD in the SEC.
     
  28. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    The combine is where players help their draft stock. Sam was probably already a mid round pick before all the hoopla, then the gay proclamation might or might not have hurt him. However, the combine numbers for sure are not helping his case.

    If teams felt iffy about him before, combine has not done anything to alleviate that.

    Personally, I would have rather he had beasted the combine. That way, the main focus would have been his talent, and not all this peripheral stuff.
     
  29. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    As I mentioned though... looking at the context of the actual production, it doesn't seem very impressive...

    And I don't see any physical attributes that scream NFL to me. Small, slow, and weak. What exactly is the appeal?
     
  30. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    You're basically taking away all of the positives and looking at just the negatives and then decrying the fact that there aren't any positives. There aren't any positives because you just took them away. It's a loaded exercise.
     
  31. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    Huh?

    At the next level... what exactly does he have going for him that translates to a guy has has potential to start, or at minimum, contribute in a significant way worth a mid-round pick?
     
  32. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    While I believe the point about black culture is a good one, my experience with players leads me to believe that "can he play" is far and away more important in the locker room than any individual prejudice.
     
  33. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    The problem is if there's hostility toward homosexuals then it taints the "can he play" thing, because without any doubt whatsoever the question of "can he play" is entirely subjective and up for interpretation. Tons of gray area.

    Take Michael Sam himself for example. This guy was Defensive Player of the Year in the most respected conference in college football. But he has physical limitations which are shown at the Combine. Where do you take that? I think most "football people" would want to look at the SEC DPOY while others will question the lack of athleticism. Where you come out on that is likely to be affected by your conscious or unconscious underpinnings.

    As I've pointed out right about now there would USUALLY be a pretty vocal crowd chiding the criticism over the SEC Defensive Player of the Year over his "underwear Olympics" numbers. But we're not seeing that. I'm hearing crickets on that front. I'm more or less hearing "Why is this guy's being gay a big deal when he can't play football?".

    I think Charles Davis nailed it when he said that what he hopes doesn't happen is that teams take the convenient excuse of "scheme fit", which of course is an amoeba of an excuse not to take a guy you secretly dislike for other reasons.
     
  34. TooGoodForDez

    TooGoodForDez Deion Sanders for GM

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    lol


    [video=youtube;z9ezE7QTk2o]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9ezE7QTk2o[/video]
     
  35. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Lol
     
  36. Claymore95

    Claymore95 Working on it... Club Member

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    :lol:
     
  37. MIASportsFan

    MIASportsFan New Member

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    I would accept him, but I would rather take a shot on a Guard/LBer/DT etc late in the draft. Something we have a need for. He is a slow, undersized pass rusher. Everyone who saw him at the combine said he looked bad. We really have no need for him.
     
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  38. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    LOL at TooGood googling Michael Sam+boner
     
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  39. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It's not about Michael Sam becoming the leader of the team, it's about the the team accepting Sam, then letting Sams personality and energy affect the locker room..a locker room that needs to be affected..

    About his game, we know, it's just about overall value, maybe in the fifth now.
     
  40. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    On tape Michael Sam reminds me of Joey Porter during the latter stages of his career when he'd lost a lot of the athletic ability that he had in the early stages of his career, FWIW.

    There's value there. It's not a ton of value but it's there.
     

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