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Underrated guys that are beasts

Discussion in 'NFL Draft Forum' started by PittPhinFan, Jan 19, 2014.

  1. PittPhinFan

    PittPhinFan New Member

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    Early man crush list.

    1. Stanley Jean-Baptiste- CB Nebraska 6'2'' 220 with great hips and ability to turn his head and make plays on the ball. Also has great hops as you can see in this great video. If he can show he has adequate speed around a 4.5 he should go somewhere in the 2nd round which he should. I would love to have him start opposite Grimes and have Taylor/Davis battle for the nickle. Also a Miami kid. Compares to Brandon Browner from Seattle. But hopefully he doesn't get into PED's lol.

    http://youtu.be/cq-FztyrMqQ http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/2042647/stanley-jean-baptiste

    2. Jeremy Hill- RB LSU 6'1'' 235 Runs with great power and keeps his legs churning. Underrated cut ability and quickness. 4.5 speed with good hands out of the backfield. Also has pass blocking ability which is what we desperately need out of our backs. I think he has lead back potential for sure. Compares to Le'Veon Bell from the Steelers with a little more breakaway speed. A few Minor character concerns but should interview well.

    http://youtu.be/_8AmF3ZcvIY http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1984260/jeremy-hill
     
  2. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    I'm not really sure Jeremy Hill is underrated.
     
  3. PittPhinFan

    PittPhinFan New Member

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    Im saying he could sneak into the 1st round discussion with a solid workout. He's projected as a 2nd-3rd round
     
  4. Bjorn

    Bjorn Season Ticket Holder

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    Paul Richardson. He is going to go late first at the highest, most likely in the second. If he had played for any other team that the Buffaloes he would be talked about as a top 15 pick. He is going to be a stud in the NFL. Im comparing him to Chad Johnson. I want him in Miami.......BAD.
     
  5. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Stanley Jean-Baptiste is certainly underrated. I was recently trying to get a better handle on Allen Robinson and so I watched Penn State play Nebraska. Those two didn't match up on one another every time, but when they did the feel I got from it was sort of a clash of the titans. It's clear that Allen Robinson is a very, very good receiver. But Stanley Jean-Baptiste battled him to about a draw, I felt. Robinson got a step on SJB and made a HELL of a play on an underthrown deep ball, coming up with it somehow. But otherwise, SJB had him covered. It was like that play to play. Robinson would use his combination of skill to get a step, then SJB would close the distance. It felt like an NFL matchup, one we could see for years.

    As for Jeremy Hill, whether he's underrated or not depends on who you speak to. Some legit consider him potentially the best back in the draft. Others casually toss him into the mid to lower area of the draft just because that's where you put tailbacks with a good name but whose evaluator hasn't studied him enough to develop any convictions one way or another.

    I'll play a long and add some guys I've been talking about. I'll try and stick to guys I feel are very underrated. That means I'll leave Aaron Donald off for now because I think he's being commonly stuck in that high 2nd round to low 1st round area. I'll make it sort of an All-Underrated team.

    QB: Brock Jensen, North Dakota State
    WR: Cody Hoffman, BYU
    WR: Devin Street, Pittsburgh
    TE: Gator Hoskins, Marshall
    OT: Billy Turner, North Dakota State
    OT: Wesley Johnson, Vanderbilt
    OG: Zach Fulton, Tennessee
    OG: Dakota Dozier, Furman
    OC: (don't have one)
    RB: Zurlon Tipton, Central Michigan
    RB: Kapri Bibbs, Colorado State

    DT: Justin Ellis, Louisiana Tech
    DT: Brent Urban, Virginia
    DE: Kareem Martin, North Carolina
    DE: James Gayle, Virginia Tech
    LB: Eddie Lackey, Baylor
    LB: Shaquil Barrett, Colorado State
    LB: Roosevelt Nix, Kent State
    CB: Stanley Jean-Baptiste, Nebraska
    CB: Shaquille Richardson, Arizona
    SS: Lonnie "Tre" Ballentine, Memphis
    FS: Nickoe Whitley, Mississippi State
     
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  6. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    ^ Good list.
    I'd obviously have Caraun Reid added to it at DT. Haven't spent much time on the secondary so I gots little input there.
     
  7. NUGap

    NUGap Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Jeremy Hill is rated just about correctly to me. I think there's a lot of potential, which is why I'm not casually tossing him aside. However, to me he's still hesitant running outside which leads to more negative and short gains than you'd like. He's an excellent runner between the tackles and has shown that he has some breakaway speed with some really nice long runs. However, I think he's a bit one-trick for now and the potential is what makes him interesting, but ultimately drops him down into the third round - maybe early fourth range. Although I'm not sure I have a handle on this RB class since it's a bit all over the place.

    I don't know how he's being rated, but there's really not a lot of major media buzz for CB Terrance Mitchell from Oregon. I recently went through all his games and while he lacks the fluidity of Ifo, I think he's an all-around better CB. He should end up in the Darius Slay, early second - late second discussion with good combine numbers. I don't know if he's underrated so much as just not being discussed.

    If we're talking overrated, the first guy on my list is Bradley Roby.
     
  8. NUGap

    NUGap Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    There's something ironic about this to me because I actually think Paul Richardson's best comparison is Mike Wallace. Both are excellent getting open deep with speed, they both have so-so hands with a tendency to drop easy passes, and really lackluster YAC on underneath throws. The thought of two Mike Wallaces on the Dolphins is a little too much for me to handle.
     
  9. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=-

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    Can I put myself on that beef cake list.

    Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 4
     
  10. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    Two years ago I thought Hoffman would be an absolute stud. I honestly forgot about him this year.


    I think Jared Abbrederis will end up underrated, and think Jeremy Gallon absolutely is.
     
  11. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Devonta Freeman. Of all the 200'ish pound heralded backs this draft I think he might just have the most upside. The natural ability is there, but he also has a great NFL body for his size that offers compact power, a phenomenal center of gravity, and has the kind of muscle structure/thickness that should quickly add and then carry another solid 7-10 pounds to where he blossoms into a durable, every down back once it's all put together, maybe reminiscent of an MJD.... or in between MJD and Jacquizz Rodgers. He's gonna be one tough cookie once he gets those little tree trunk legs built up. Not to mention he already has a grasp on pass protection and displays a willingness to do so. I'd be content walking away from the 3rd round with him.
     
  12. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    He is WAY skinny, that's a concern.
     
  13. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    As a Noles fan I'm going to disagree with you. I might take James Wilder over freeman. Freeman to me just screams college running back. Quick but not fast, doesn't run in between the tackles all that great, doesn't run through contact often enough. There are some things I like. His vision is good. And he has good quickness. I just don't see him being a really good back in the pros. Wilder has a lot of untapped potential, is bigger and stronger, and runs like a Mac truck.
     
  14. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    There's something about Devonta Freeman that also makes me think college and wants me to rate him no higher than James White or Antonio Andrews. Both of whom I genuinely like, by the way.
     
  15. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    If the value at OL isn't there at #19 I think that I'd be ok with OLB Kyle Van Noy, assuming that Wheeler (and probably Ellerbe) will be sent packing when their contracts allow for in in 2015. He certainly has the pass rush, I could see him and Dion Jordan opposite each other at OLB. Solid all around player.
     
  16. Limbo

    Limbo Mad Stillz

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    I'm also a fan of James White, a bit underrated at this point. His vision in particular makes me buy into projecting NFL success.
     
  17. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    He looks and moves like a running back. The question I always ask myself about these guys is...do they look and move like a GOOD running back? Or is this one of those guys like a Bobby Rainey that could find himself in the right situation and having short-lived success, but it just doesn't last.
     
  18. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Antonio Andrews is like a poor man's Kevin Smith who will need a sundial to time his 40. I think he looks the part of a jag and I have a hard time finding him draftable.

    IDK about James White either. He's definitely a jitterbug, but to me that's all he seems to be. I see a lot more to Freeman's game than with either of those backs. I'd say Freeman is closer to Tre Mason than White but that's just me, whereas I see White more like a Dion Lewis, a reserve at the next level. I think I prefer Freeman to Sankey TBH. In my eyes, when compared to White, Freeman plays faster, runs behind his pads better, runs with a better center of gravity and with more power & authority, and for the most part knows when to juke and when to duck his head and pick up what he can. White is impressively elusive but he's not slippery, doesn't bounce off tackles, doesn't use a stiff arm, and can't push a defender for an extra yard or two, all things that Freeman does do to some degree, and IMO does well for a 200 pounder. Basically if White doesn't juke the defender then he's going down like a bag a bricks. Freeman's not a power back but at least he can compliment his wiggle and burst by occasionally running through tacklers, bouncing off them, or planting a face into the dirt. He does a better job of finishing runs, understands he cant just resort to juking every would-be tackler, and plays with greater forward lean. He has the ability to bounce it outside, can run the outside stretch well and knows when to put his foot in the ground, and has enough vision and patience to meander through trash between the tackles. Plus White's pass protection is suspect.

    I don't believe we'll see James White truckin' a safety like this:
    [video=youtube;KSwDiHkwQcc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSwDiHkwQcc[/video]
    **Watch when Freeman gets up after the above run and hops back to the field [like he's got springs in his cleats no less]. Notice the impressive lower body thickness which will only get bigger and stronger in the NFL b/c of his frame...... kinda like Ray Rice who was 199 at the combine [at 5'8] and quickly thickened up to a stout 210-215 with the Ravens.


    There's something about Freeman that reminds me back to Andre Ellington who is as good or better in the pros despite seeming undersized in college and not posting a blistering forty time. Since college ball finished Ellington has thickened up a little and is looking more like the part of an NFL back to go along with the plethora of other solid attribute he already possesses. I could easily see Freeman doing the same, only with a little better power but perhaps not quite as good out of the backfield.

    [video=youtube;ZmQAxB7ZEBU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmQAxB7ZEBU[/video]
    [video=youtube;hIIxQNKUiCk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hIIxQNKUiCk[/video]
    [video=youtube;XxiKpKVb-80]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxiKpKVb-80[/video]
     
  19. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    I respect your opinion as a Noles fan but I personally wouldn't take Wilder over Freeman. He couldn't beat out Freeman in his own backfield for touches. Freeman had more than double Wilder's carries this year, 19 more receptions, appeared more reliable in pass protection from what I saw, and inside the redzone where you'd think Wilder and his impressive size would garner greater trust to punch it in, it was the smaller Freeman who received the majority of the carries and with greater success [13 TDs in 39 attempts compared to Wilder's 7 in 24].

    I don't see Wilder running like a Mac truck. I see him making a few nice highlight reel runs but IMO he's no means close to Eddie Lacy's power, and certainly not like Le'Garrette Blount. His power and upright running style is closer to what we already have in Daniel Thomas, and I wouldn't spend a mid round pick on Wilder thinking he's a certain replacement or even an upgrade to Thomas. If I'm gonna go that route then I'd rather re-sign Thomas for peanuts and use that draft pick to bring in a back we don't already have- an elusive COP with solid vision and patience like Freeman or Seastrunk for Razor to utilize. If I'm looking for a power back I'd rather do it and do it as close to right as possible and grab Carlos Hyde, even he doesn't blow me away like Lacy did. I'd ultimately go with Freeman over Seastrunk b/c I get the impression he'll be more durable in the NFL and I prefer the greater authority he runs with. The thought of using our 2nd rounder on Mason doesn't excite me so I omitted his name, and I don't think you lose much going from Mason to Freeman, but you gain in the value department by it costing a lower pick.
     
  20. TooGoodForDez

    TooGoodForDez Deion Sanders for GM

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    Freeman looks great. I love crazy running backs who look for concussions. But he will suffer from Robbie Rouse syndrome. Will have to prove he can block, a little bit, and not be overwhelmed by a 6'3" 240 rusher.
     
  21. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Watch his actual game clips. He does an admirable job in pass pro.
     
  22. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    Wilder definitely has an upright running style, but he most certainly does not run like Daniel Thomas. When I said I might pick wilder over freeman, remember, I still said might.

    And it would be based on pure potential. I wouldn't pick freeman in the first 3 rounds either. So if I'm in the middle rounds, and I have both guys on the board, it would be a tough decision for me. And I might take Wilder.
     
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  23. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    He's always reminded me of deangelo Williams without the long speed. Which I'm not sure plays well at the next level.
     
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  24. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I'd take Karlos Williams over both Freeman and Wilder.
     
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  25. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    Well I agree 100%. He's going to be a stud next year.
     
  26. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't know if he's underrated so much as a victim of his position, but I think Jay Prosch looks like he's going to be the next Lorenzo Neal. He seems like a guy you'd think would show up disproportionately in the mid-rounds on a lot of mock drafts for the teams that will use lead blockers.
     
  27. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    I know Prosch is rated as the top FB but I actually like JC Copeland better. IMO there's a noticeable difference in their feel for the game as a blocker. Copeland seems more natural and knows how to better utilize every bit of his weight, leverage, balance, coordination, and momentum to plant his opponent. He's the one more like Lorenzo Neal IMO..... and Copeland is the more savy runner and perhaps better out of the backfield.

    Copeland has a better center of gravity, does a better job playing behind his pads and under his opponent's, and often beats his man to the punch before the other guy has a chance to set himself, whereas Prosch too often for my taste seems hesitant, apprehensive, and lets his man get in on him to where he has to rely on brute strength to get the block. Prosch doesn't always locate his block or maintain it. Plus he seems slower twitched and heavier footed, so I could see him having difficulty in the NFL with faster, stronger, more agile defenders, especially after having his hands full with Christian Jones. Here's a decent bit of him in this Tre Mason clip from the championship game. Most of what I've seen from his is about on par with this, some a little better, some worse. But like I said, I'm in the minority so it'll be interesting to see looks better at the next level.

    [video=youtube;4GrKp7unZ4w]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GrKp7unZ4w[/video]

    compared to Copeland:
    [video=youtube;4WrjD9jYx4U]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WrjD9jYx4U[/video]
     

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