http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000079254/article/brian-hartline-more-than-a-deceptively-fast-dolphin?module=HP11_headline_stack Nope. Just plain fast.
IMO if you can occasionally get behind a defender but then be caught from behind, you're deceptively fast.
Where did 'African-American' come from? I can;t believe NFL.com keeps implying Asians cannot run as fast as Inuit people.
His history as a hurdler is something that's been touted as evidence of his speed, yet here are the specifics of that history: Being a high school state champion hurdler in Ohio and then becoming almost completely non-competitive at the college level isn't exactly evidence of great speed. It's not like he was competitive at the college level in the 100 meter dash, for example, which by contrast would be clear evidence of great speed. When you deconstruct the non-specific label "champion hurdler" and get this, it's not real reassuring of his speed IMO. I mean obviously he's not slow, but we're talking about having rare speed even among people who have rare speed -- NFL wide receivers -- and this hurdling history isn't anywhere near evidence of that IMO.
Not sure where that quote came from but I don't agree that a freshman coming in 7th in the conference championship in hurdling is indicative of him not being competitive.
Don't forget that all white D-linemen have a "high motor". That's not to say the scouts don't sometimes say black D-linemen have "high motors" as well. However, every single time a scout talks/writes about a white D-lineman, you can bet he's gonna say the dude's got a "high motor". Yes, racism exists.
He ran a 4.58 in the combine. I don't see how he can be regarded as fast. But, he can get open by running good routes, with a good burst out of a cut, as Wes Welker can, and he's tall at 6'2 so that gives him some advantage when he gets to full speed (as Jerry Rice did - once he got going in his prime - no one would catch him). I don't really care as long as he keeps making plays.
So? No one is claiming Hartline has word class speed. But just making the Big 10 conference championship for hurdling is an accomplishment that would suggest he is fast.
Hurdling and sprinting are totally different. You can have above average speed and be the best hurdler, and you can have world class speed and not even be close to the best. The same is not true of sprinting, you're either fast or you're not.
I imagine that if you're your team's hurdler for those particular events, you're going to be running in the conference championship against the hurdlers from the other teams in the conference, regardless of how good you are. Either way, we're an awful long way from Willie Gault, here.
I could be wrong but I don't think that's how it works. I think each school is entering multiple hurdlers in the competition and they get weeded out in preliminary heats until they put the top 10 in the championship heat. Why else would the article be touting a 7th place result as some accomplishment. But yeah, Wille Gault he ain't.
You know what I'm just going to throwout alot of codewords for white WRs. "He runs good routes" "He is smart" "He has alot of heart and passion for the game" and my personal favorite "He is a gritty player"
Your not wrong this is the finals it weeded all kinds to get there. WOW Jerry Rice was white? Or did you describe Shannon Sharp?
Ya know, I've seen those statements over the years and never once did I think "Oh, this guy is [whatever] race". Where do you guys get this from ?? Right now, he's the leading yardage WR in the NFL this season. I do wish he were the leading TD maker, but I'll take whatever he can give us for now... Thanks, Mr. Hartline...
I think for anyone's history as a hurdler, in itself, to establish him as having significantly better speed than the average NFL wide receiver, that history would have to include having been at least ultra-competitive at the college level, if not olympic trials caliber, and even then there would still be some question IMO. Now, "Willie Gault" level, no question. The take-home message is that Hartline's specific history as a hurdler, in itself, doesn't establish him as anything significant speed-wise in comparison to the average NFL wide receiver, so I think we should stop throwing that around as evidence of such.
My "theory" has been that his hurdling background doesn't necessarily show or reflect his pure speed, but a hurdler has to be able to run fast while maintaining concentration and body control to that he can clear the hurdles. I have seen Hartlien repeatedly run past guys and get deep separation against guys who are supposed to be faster. He may not be as fast as some of those guys in a "put your head down and just run as fast as you can" sort of way, but he may be faster while running a route, looking back for the ball, etc. Again, just a theory but it makes sense to me. Ultimately, I don't care whether he gets open because he's fast or because he's crafty, as long as he gets open. And he does.
And I think Hartline is great, but I think he's best suited to a possession role, with Bess in the slot, and with a guy with great speed on the opposite side of the field. I think the offense needs somebody defenses have to respect simply because of his elite downfield speed. In that scenario Hartline may still very well be the go-to guy in terms of number of targets and receptions, similar to how Tim Brown was that guy opposite James Jett for the Raiders, and he may therefore for all intents and purposes remain the "number one" guy. However, I think there needs to be more speed out there as a threat if nothing else. The guy with elite deep speed doesn't necessarily have to be the "number one" receiver.
While I think Hartline is faster than he gets credit for, I agree that a true speedster would help open up the field for everyone and that the type of reciever doesn't necessarily need to be the number 1 guy. A speed guy who can actually catch the ball would be even better (see Ginn, Gates etc...).
Interesting..so right now, you would want a deep threat receiver to open things up for Hart and Bess?.. What about simply adding another player of the caliber of Bess or Hart? Having three payers of that caliber on the field, or two and some measureables?
I disagree. I think it's much harder for defenses when ALL THREE guys can do anything, instead of knowing who is porbably running the deep route, the mid route, the short route. Give me three 6'2 1/2" WR's who run 4.52, good routes, good cuts, decent hands and I'll show you a defense that's ****ed.
