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QB T.J. Yates, North Carolina

Discussion in 'NFL Draft Forum' started by ckparrothead, Dec 27, 2010.

  1. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Continuing on in my series on the QB position, since it's the one that everyone wants to know about, here is my take on T.J. Yates of North Carolina. Now, I've been talking about Yates a lot this year. Read through previous posts and you'll see that, I've been one of the few beating his drum.

    Like Ben Chappell, whom I will be doing a workup on some time soon, Yates is one of the most underrated players in the entire Draft. Nobody is talking about the guy right now. I can guess why. The reason is because prior to this year, he hadn't quite "got it" yet, and since he'd been playing for so long without climbing into the highest reaches of statistical monsters in the league, people want to ignore the player he has become because they're naturally skeptical of the growth trajectory. Something has to be fake about it. He can't be this good. He can't have gone from the player that was disappointing people two years ago, to the inconsistent player he was a year ago, to the consistent field general he is this year.

    In that way, his story reminds me of Jason Campbell's. Campbell was a continual disappointment at Auburn, but he also had to deal with changing offensive coordinators and systems, and by the time he finally settled into a system for the second year in a row, he was really, really good. People are still doubting him in the pros, laughably starting Bruce Gradkowski over him. All he does? Go out there and perform. His QB rating is always in the mid-80's, and when he's in the Raiders offense they score 27 points a game. Point being, when Campbell was coming out, he was a sneaky guy that floated up the Draft boards...and the media market had to kind of slowly get used to the idea that he was a genuine high rated prospect, because for years he'd been the disappointment guy.

    Where do I ultimatley have T.J. Yates. I'm not sure I can decide that, yet. I know that I have picked out five quarterbacks in this Draft that I genuinely LIKE and would want. So, if you want to simplify it, I like T.J. Yates better than everyone not named Andrew Luck, Blaine Gabbert, Pat Devlin and Ben Chappell...and perhaps above Chappell, maybe even ahead of Devlin. Who knows? I'm still waffling on Cameron Newton. He's not among the "guys I like" list yet...but he is among the "guys I wouldn't mind drafting" list.

    I think that if the Miami Dolphins drafted T.J. Yates in the 2nd Round of the 2011 Draft, there would be a lot of boos. I would not be among them, and I would argue hard to soothe peoples' anger over that. In my heart, he's that caliber a prospect.

    Background: He was not a super high recruit out of High School. He only played one year at Pope High School, but he'd been playing football since he was 4 years old. He was a multi-sport athlete. He averaged 18 points, 6 rebounds and 6 assists as a backetball player. He threw for 2300 yards and 17 TDs, rushed for 300 yards and 7 TDs, and punted 34 times for 1237 yards in his one year at Pope High. He was rated the 60th prospect in the state of Georgia by SuperPrep. You know what I find funny? I'll get to more about this later, but the players I wanted to compare him to are Peyton Manning and Chad Pennington. Sure enough, in his background, one discovers that he grew up near Indianapolis and his favorite team is the Colts, and he follows them closely to this day. It shows.

    Surrounding Cast & Offense: This is a pro style offense, almost to its own detriment. It's a play-action based system with a vertical passing game, rollouts, protections, double moves, delay routes, pump fakes, check down options, hot reads, cut-offs, option routes, screens, audibles, everything you might see at the NFL level or on the Miami Dolphins (except ironically, more detail and execution oriented). His offensive line is not particularly good at all. As Simon once put it, Right Tackle Mike Ingersol is the second worst offensive lineman he's graded all year. Heading into this year, Yates had to be awful excited about having the likes of WR Greg Little, RB Johnny White, RB Anthony Elzy and TE Zach Pianalto. Too bad! Little got caught up in the huge NCAA violations snafu along with Marvin Austin, out for the entire year. Pianalto made it 6 games before getting hurt. Anthony Elzy was one of his top passing targets and made it 8 games before he got hurt. Johnny White made it 9 games before getting hurt. And let's not mention the players on defense that have had to miss all or part of the year, due to the scandal. A defense that was supposed to be the best in the country has instead allowed 23 points a game. New targets have emerged for Yates, chief among them the deep threat Dwight Jones. Erik Highsmith is not a dynamic player, and the tight ends after Pianalto are just bodies. Yet, they are 7-5 and haven an upcoming Bowl game against the Tennessee Volunteers.

    Throwing Skills: He doesn't have a hot cannon like some of these players (Ryan Mallett, Jake Locker, Blaine Gabbert), but he doesn't have to get a full follow-through in order to get juice on his 20-25 yard throws either. I would say his arm is somewhere in the viscinity of Andrew Luck's. He can smoke the 15 to 20 yard ball, and launch the ball 60 yards vertically with high trajectory and good spin on a relatively painless wind-up and delivery. He regularly does so, and very, very accurately. He throws naturally, he doesn't aim the ball on his short throws, or look awkward in any way. His comfort zone is between 15 and 25 yards, and he'll opt for throws in that range within the offense on most of his throws. But as I mentioned, he mixes them up with 50 to 60 yard verticals, which are most often on the mark. I can watch Blaine Gabbert hit 1 of 7 deep vertical throws, where T.J. Yates even with players he didn't necessarily know he'd be relying on, will hit on more like 6 of 7 deep verticals right in stride. His ability on the deep vertical is one of the more amazing aspects of his game. When he misses, he only JUST misses. He leads his receiver excellently. Speaking of leading his receiver, his passing offense is really very oriented toward hitting receivers on the move rather than receivers coming back to the quarterback. It's more RAC-friendly. On the one hand this means that he doesn't have a lot of tape of the kinds of throws Chad Henne is asked to make regularly, the comebacks and curls, etc. On the other hand, it shows how good his location is that he can get the ball to players on the move and run a more RAC-friendly offense, and those offenses are more successful in the NFL than Miami's conservative passing principles.

    Throwing Mechanics: Sometimes his ball will come out at about an earhole delivery, due to his focus on quick, three-quarters release. This is especially the case due to his focus on passes in the 15 to 25 yard range through the air. This is as opposed to Pat Devlin, who has the same quick release, but still gets the ball up over top even on the short passes. Yates gets his arm up on bigger throws, and like I said his release is quick and mechanically very sound. He steps into his throws, as TedSlimmJr points out stays over his front foot. On his deep throws, his shoulder aiming is ideal.

    Pocket Mechanics: This is the most fundamentally sound technician in the Draft at the quarterback position, overall. As I said before, it's funny watching him and thinking, I'm watching a young Peyton Manning, he's THAT obsessive-compulsive over the details and minutae...and then you find out he's been a Colts fan all his life and keeps close track of them to this day. His fake and handoff mechanics go beyond "good". To him, they're at the level of an art. He sticks the ball out, ducks his head, and has a commitment to making his fakes and handoffs look identical. He takes the time and shows haste and commitment to faking after the handoff, whether it be faking like he still has the ball and he's about to pass it, or faking an end-around handoff after the fact. He is a dropback passer that pops his head around quickly after the play fake, and his feet are in a real hurry to get back from center. He moves his feet quickly and doesn't elongate his stride, which makes him more reactive during his setup. He uses the pocket and slides through it rather than running away from it, breathing well inside the pocket. I don't sense issues with batted balls. At quarterback you want a guy that owns the football, and he owns the football. He is able to quickly get control of bad shotgun snaps, and on other shotgun snaps his ability to get control of the ball looks effortless. His manipulation of defensive players on screens is very good.

    Offensive Command: His mastery of this fully pro style play-action vertical passing and screen offense is not quite at Peyton Manning levels, but you can tell that he is committed to being there the more he works at it. He makes every detail of the game his obsession, including things like a hard count with a subtle head bob, things of that nature. He regularly audibles, uses formation changes, motion, sets protections, and calls for hot reads and cutoffs. He runs the offense like a top, never runs into time issues, never seems to need a timeout. He seems particularly good at running the offense through the 2 minute drill. He executed one of the most impressive 60 second drills I've seen this season college or pro in his first game of the 2010 season against LSU. He started the drive with the ball at his own 27 yard line, 1:08 remaining with NO timeouts, and down 6 points against a top SEC defense. He methodically got the ball all the way to LSU's 6 yard line before Zach Pianalto dropped two balls in the end zone to end the game, the second drop featuring Defensive Pass Interference that went uncalled.

    Reading Defenses: His ability to read the field is highly evident. He is not quite as adept at using his eyes to fake defenders as Pat Devlin, but he's close, and he is right there with Devlin as far as taking in the whole field and getting down to his 3rd and 4th reads. He, like Devlin, is far more advanced than Blaine Gabbert in this regard. Except, unlike Pat Devlin, this guy is doing it against the likes of LSU, Florida State, Clemson and NC State, and that really has to count for something. One thing that he shows that I really like is the ability to stay on the same page and read the improvisation of his receivers. His receiver we'll point somewhere, he'll SEE IT, and he'll make the throw. You wouldn't think so, but it's pretty rare for a quarterback to be able to see everything on the field and have the game be slow for him to where he can make those kinds of reads and decisions on the fly. He will play with a trust level in his receivers, throwing the ball and letting them make a play on it. The throwaway is very much in his arsenal, he does it regularly, he's an unselfish player. He understands how to play the high-low game to victimize zone coverage and going back to the eyes, it's one of the many details that uses and I have no doubt he'll continue to work on it at the next level. I have noticed that he can be robbed underneath, and at times he can forget zone defenders coming from way over. Virginia Tech had a successful strategy to take away his deep ball and force some turnovers, and that was to have the defensive back on the back side bail all the way back and help with the deep vertical to the play side. He can also try and fit the ball into too tight a window, at times, relying on his arm too much. This is the sin of many a great, confident quarterback.

    Timing & Anticipation: His timing and anticipation are about as good as it gets at this level. He throws the ball often before the player makes his break. He gets good timing on the ball even on 3rd or 4th reads, without necessarily hurrying through his progression or skipping open players. He shows good timing on screens to the runner.

    Ball Location: He will go through pretty long stretches where his ball location on short routes is excellent, but then he can screw it up at times, as most of these guys do. He has much better ball location than Blaine Gabbert, from what I've seen. Pat Devlin might have better location, just because Devlin can go almost an entire game without throwing more than one or two off on the location. Again though I have to emphasize that his placement on the deep vertical is pretty damn special.

    Under Pressure: This is his biggest weakness, really. He's a safe decision maker under pressure, but he will also get sacked. He doesn't have the physical prowess to step up and create on the move. This is not unlike Peyton Manning. If you get Peyton on the move, you're putting him in a position where he's a lot less effective. He's up and down on the bootleg with pressure on his face. I've seen him take sacks and look a little questionable on it because he can't create, but at the same time I often see him get his head around quickly and release the ball very quickly off the boot. If the guy is open, the ball is coming out catchable and timely. If he's not, and there's pressure right in his face off the boot, that's where sack issues come into play. He also needs to learn to slide in appropriate situations. He may have an alarming number of the details right, but there are still other details left to be mastered.

    Touch: His touch on short passes is natural, and on the deep verticals is downright perfect. The ball doesn't sail, he gets the nose of the football down. If you want to see a deep passing CLINIC, then watch his game against Florida State this year. You will see what I mena. His combination of timing, footwork, and touch on the screen pass make him probably the most advanced screen passer in the Draft, and North Carolina commonly used the screen pass as a weapon. What is more of a question mark is his shoulder aiming, touch and accuracy on the kinds of passes designed to fit into the spaces between the zones. He doesn't make a whole lot of use of the intermediate depth areas, so there isn't a lot of tape of these kinds of throws.

    On-Field Demeanor: He is very calm on the field, communicates well. I don't see him angry, don't sense selfish throws or selfish plays. He seems to get excited along with his players. I just don't sense an issue this way.

    Feet: Nobody is ever going to confuse him for a track star. When you get him out of the pocket and on the hoof, you're more holding your breath than anything else, because you know that more often than not, the best you're hoping for is a throwaway decision. However, his feet in the pocket are not at all leaden. They're very lively, within the pocket. He can step up, into and through the pocket, finding passing lanes. He's much quicker than Chad Henne in this way, because the feet match the speed of his mind, and he's a quicker thinker than Chad Henne.

    Overall: Peyton Manning is the name that keeps coming to mind as I watch him play. Not necessarily because he's got Peyton's talent, but because he's got Peyton's dedication to the details and the art of operating an offense on the field as a field general. As I said, I looked back at my initial notes on Yates and the name Peyton Manning popped up four times. Then I do some more background and discover Yates grew up around Indianapolis and is a big Colts follower to this day. That's the definition of 'not a coincidence'. I just got done telling another fellow draftnik it wouldn't surprise me if T.J. Yates had been to Manning Camp. Sure enough I do some more checking as I write this, he attended Manning Passing Academy three years in a row 2008, 2009 and 2010. There, he taught 900 kids how to play quarterback. What exactly did Manning boys put Yates in charge of teaching in 2009? What else? Throwing the long ball. "You have to get a high release, wide base and get some air under the ball so the nose will be pointing down and land right where you want it. We put a bucket downfield and had the kids try to throw into it". The reason you buy a T.J. Yates is the reason he's the only QB I can think of that has been to three straight Manning Camps...commitment to the art of playing quarterback. He is committed to mastering every minute detail of the game, and quite frankly, he's shown in 2010 a monstrous aptitude for getting those details right on an every-play basis. He makes mistakes and he gets careless, but that commitment to the art of playing quarterback was always present in 2010, every game. The release, the technique, the mechanics, fakes, hand-offs, eye use, understanding what a defense is doing to him, understanding what he wants to do with his offense, getting players on the same page with him.

    We talk a lot about upside in the Draft game. The quarterback is a unique position, because it's one where discussions of upside are not exclusive to the subject of a guy's size, his arm strength, his inherent accuracy, or his feet. With a quarterback there is an upside associated with how much information a guy can process at one time. There is an upside in how dedicated a guy is at getting every minute detail of the position down. There is an upside associated with how hard a guy is willing to work in order to prepare each week for the game. Those are T.J. Yates' weapons. They're his tools. They're the reason he should continue to get better, the same reason why even when everyone thought guys like Peyton Manning and Tom Brady were maxed out by their fourth or fifth years in the league...they continued to get even better and better. I don't know how good T.J. Yates will end up. What I do know is he's really good right now, and even though I think you're going to hear some people claim that his upside is limited, or he's as good as he's going to be, I can guarantee that he'll get better...because he has the commitment to the details and the art of playing the game. Oh, and the size, arm strength, accuracy, all that? Not bad, either.
     
  2. uab_phin

    uab_phin New Member

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    I really liked him in the LSU game especially the way that he led his team after losing all those players. What were some of the causes of his inconsistency in the past?
     
  3. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Injuries (fractured ankle, shoulder tear, some others), the offense having to shuffle in a bunch of freshmen in 2009, poor decision making. They've had poor pass protection the whole time but in 2010 he really hit his stride as far as adapting his game around that, getting the ball out, and not making the risky decision. He had a few games where he had some risky throws, like the Virginia Tech game and the Miami game.
     
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  4. sports24/7

    sports24/7 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I've told you before I'm not a huge fan of Yates because when I've seen him play he didn't impress me all that much. I've also told you that I trust your judgement over my own when it comes to this sort of thing though, and after reading that writeup I'm certainly more interested in the kid. There's something to be said for that kind of attention to detail at the QB position.
     
  5. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    Me and you have had conversion on TJ already. I really like him and agree on the 2nd round comment.

    I said prior I thought he would end of going in the 2nd round when its all said and done, a couple people said no way(not you obviously Chris), but I truly believe that. He flashed 1st round ability at times this year, a bit inconsistent, but had his stretches none the less. Great leader and great great deep ball, specially this year
     
  6. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    I liked him a lot in the LSU game, but that's really the only game I have to base an opinion of him on.
     
  7. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    If you want to see him at his absolute best, watch the FSU game. He was ridiculous with the deep ball in that game. They had a punt DISASTER happen at a critical moment in the game. The snap went way over the punter's head and caroming backward toward the end zone. The punter chased it down and kicked it through the back of the end zone for a safety. Problem is, that's illegal. He kicked the ball while it was still maybe on the 2 yard line or so, and you're not allowed to kick the ball like that. He got called for the penalty and the ball was placed right on the door step of the end zone late in 4th quarter of a 34-28 ball game...and of course FSU just banged the ball right in to go up 35-34.

    What happened next, Butch Davis would go on to call the single best drive he had been a part of since taking on the job as Head Coach of North Carolina. T.J. Yates engineered a 72 yard drive that started on their own 23 yard line. The drive started with 5:49 left on the clock but Yates' clock management during the drive helped run it all the way down to 55 seconds before they kicked a field goal from the FSU 5 yard line. Of course, some people will remember the one mistake he had on the drive...on the final play when he rolled out and was looking for the TD pass, pulled the ball down and wisely decided to scramble for yardage instead of forcing a risky pass in a crucial situation...but when he ran, he ran out of bounds, stopping the clock and allowing FSU to keep one of their timeouts. Still, his clock management during the drive is what got them down to less than a minute before they kicked that field goal to begin with, and FSU had 2 timeouts, and by the time they got the ball back they got it on UNC's 45 yard line because Greg Reid returned the kickoff 50 yards. The extra timeout that FSU had, really didn't come into play. They, in typical FSU fashion, of course missed the field goal wide right. :)

    There was also a play in a VERY clutch moment during the Clemson game. It was again a situation where UNC was up by 5 points and they get the ball with 6 minutes remaining. They're trying to chew up the clock. Johnny White runs well for them, 31 yards on 5 carries, getting two 1st downs along the way. But, he has a run for a loss of 2 yards that forces a 3rd & 9. UNC needs this conversion or Clemson has plenty of time to try and drive for the TD and they'd just successfully driven for the TD on their very last drive. Coach Shoop calls a play-action boot pass, which he calls too often and every defense that UNC faces sees it coming, but that's a different tale. Clemson has the weak side DE, I believe it was DaQuan Bowers...right in Yates' face the moment he gets his head around on the boot. Like I said, defenses know it's coming and they adjust, have the weak side DE run out to the QB to intercept him on the boot and Bowers is doing that perfectly. But one of the things you notice that Yates does so well is he gets the ball out of his hands very quickly when necessary on the boot (especially to the right side, he's not as good at it when he boots left). Somehow he is able to flick the ball instantaneously as soon as he gets his head around and sees Bowers in his face...and it was such a quick flick Bowers had no time to react to the ball, and of course the ball makes it right into Johnny White's bread basket for a 12 yard gain on 3rd & 9. You could tell the QB had to get the ball out early and had just made a pretty incredible play, because White found the ball stuck in his gut before he even knew it was coming, and Johnny made a heck of play securing it even though it was early (by necessity).

    I'm not saying that T.J. Yates has always been clutch. But in 2010 it seemed like he was. You watch the way the LSU game ended, the way the FSU game ended, the way the NC State game ended, the way he came back in the 4th quarter being inexplicably down against William & Mary, the Georgia Tech game came down to a final drive that stalled at mid-field...they had a 24-10 lead on Duke that got eaten up when Shaun Draughn got tackled in the backfield for a safety and then Duke got a TD on the ensuing drive. By the time Yates got the ball back it was 24-19 with 3:20 remaining and they needed to run out the clock. He hit a nice 9 yard pass which made it possible for them to get another 1st down running. They ran the ball the rest of the way and by the time Duke got it back they had less than a minute to score a TD...which interestingly enough is exactly the situation Yates was in against LSU, where he got them down to like the 5 yard line and had two passes in the end zone to Pianalto dropped. But Duke doesn't have that kind of veteran presence and of course they failed.

    Quarter by Quarter Passing Results:
    1st: 129.5 QB Rating - 83 of 100, 1128 yards, 6 TDs, 1 INT, 13 runs, 52 yards, 0 TDs, 5 sacks, -38 yards
    2nd: 88.6 QB Rating - 62 of 105, 719 yards, 4 TDs, 1 INT, 10 runs, 45 yards, 2 TDs, 8 sacks, -69 yards
    3rd: 84.7 QB Rating - 55 of 88, 624 yards, 4 TDs, 3 INTs, 9 runs, 49 yards, 0 TDs, 11 sacks, -57 yards
    4th: 93.6 QB Rating - 64 of 94, 765 yards, 4 TDs, 3 INTs, 10 runs, 40 yards, 0 TDs, 10 sacks, -77 yards
    Total: 100.1 QB Rating - 264 of 387, 3181 yards, 18 TDs, 8 INTs, 42 runs, 186 yards, 2 TDs, 34 sacks, -241 yards

    What makes the statistics a little more appropriate in this case is the fact that Yates ran a truly pro style offense, and we're talking classic pro style, vertical passing game, heavy protections, heavy TE use, run and play-action based, etc.
     
  8. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Incidentally, Yates has had 1 delay of game penalty the whole year...that first game against LSU, in the 3rd Quarter.
     
  9. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Yates playing right now. Big stage, what'll he do?
     
  10. emocomputerjock

    emocomputerjock Senior Member

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    Hand the ball off for huge gains? :lol:
     
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  11. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    LOL. He's playing well. Definitely a running offense. But a lot is going into this. I'm willing to bet not all of these runs are being called by John Shoop. It's the details that he is so good with. On that 3rd & 1 conversion just now watch his head and listen to his voice. It's 3rd & 1 and it's a run play, he could figure ok my only job here is just to hand the ball off and hope. But, that's not what he thinks. He thinks, I can convert this thing before I even hand the ball off, if I draw them off sides with my cadence and head.
     
  12. Tin Indian

    Tin Indian Rockin' The Bottom End Club Member

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    Nice play with his feet and arm to answer the Vols before the half.
     
  13. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    These officials have done a good job late here. Kudos.
     
  14. byroan

    byroan Giggity Staff Member Administrator Luxury Box

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    This is one of the most amazing finishes I've ever seen.
     
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  15. byroan

    byroan Giggity Staff Member Administrator Luxury Box

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    Missed the obvious late hit but otherwise have been good.
     
  16. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

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    That was a very good throw in between the safety and corner.
     
  17. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    What a athletic play by Sturdivant.
     
  18. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    That was yet another in a pretty long string of clutch performances from T.J. Yates this year. It wasn't always pretty, but he also had some things working against him.

    You don't have to execute every pass to perfection, especially when your back is against the wall and you're aiming for chunk plays. That was a bad intentional grounding. He had a WR in the area running to the sideline and he didn't have good leverage, but he still should have got it further upfield.

    But you know what? He made up for it. That 4th & 20 throw was PERFECT and CLUTCH. Dwight Jones dropped a ball they hit him in the chest perfectly.

    But you know what I find interesting? There is NO QUIT in that offense. They get their backs against the wall, it's 4th & 20, they still know they can execute and do the impossible. They don't do that because Jones uncharacteristically drops the ball, they know they're going to get the ball back with about 30 seconds left and no timeouts on their own 20 yard line, THERE WAS NO QUIT IN THEM. I can tell you why, it's because they've been there before. They have executed with T.J. Yates at the helm in exactly that situation and either come out on the winning end, or come damn close to it. Does it surprise me that the most clutch quarterback in college football this year managed to execute a drive that took the team from their own 20 yard line to a 38 yard field goal in about 35 seconds, with no timeouts at their disposal? It should surprise the hell out of anyone that any team does that, but it actually doesn't surprise me. Like I said, I've seen it before from Yates, multiple times.

    When you do not self-destruct and you keep believing, and you have the right leadership, good things happen. Tennessee self-destructed and North Carolina stayed composed and pushed on.

    Particularly awesome was when T.J. Yates proved smarter than his own coaching staff, knowing damn well after that Shaun Draughn run that he needed to get up and clock the ball, while his coaching staff STUPIDLY tried to run out the FG unit onto the field with only 10 seconds left as if there was any hope of kicking a FG with that amount of time ticking off, not to mention even if you could it's not even remotely desirable when you can comfortable kill the clock and then take as much time as you want to set up your FG unit.

    Captain Clutch.
     
  19. Boomer

    Boomer Premium Member Luxury Box

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    He's a really, really good ILB.
     
  20. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

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    Sure would love to have him in Channing's spot.
     
  21. Boomer

    Boomer Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Yeah. I agree. Instincts are second to none. Ability to fill the hole, disengage and make the tackle, second to none. People talk up Greg Jones at MSU, Sturvidant is a flat out better player.
     
  22. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I agree that Sturdivant is a flat out better player, but I also think he will probably be like a Brandon Spikes/Channing Crowder at the next level...ideally a two down player.
     
  23. Boomer

    Boomer Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Just a better, more productive 2 down player.
     
  24. Starry31

    Starry31 Phins and Heels.

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    Appreciate the write-up on Yates and he's a guy I'd love to see Miami grab. Not a scout guy but as a UNC fan I've seen every game aside from one or two that wasn't televised and you said pretty much everything I could. And as you mentioned, one of the things with Yates is his seasons prior to this year weren't as impressive so there's skepticism with his progress. Before the season started if you heard UNC fans having a conversation you would hear that they knew the defense would get the job done, but worried about the offense doing the same, in part due to Yates. Funny how things turn out huh? The what could have been with regards to this season is tough to swallow but what a way to finish out.
     
  25. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Better and more productive than Crowder and Spikes? Not sure I see that. Could be.
     
  26. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    What's interesting to me is if he does have NFL success, then he'll have gone from a guy that UNC fans booed at a basketball game when they put his face up on the jumbotron to a guy that is a successful NFL starter...which is kind of interesting.
     
  27. Starry31

    Starry31 Phins and Heels.

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    That's what is in the back of my mind. Just a few years ago UNC needed a TD drive late in a bowl game and had no confidence in Yates leading them down the field, today I want him in a Phins uniform.

    By the way, as an aside I hated to hear the story of him being booed. Booing any college kid isn't something I'm a fan of, especially one on your favorite team. These guys are kids basically and aren't getting paid (outside of the SEC), not like Yates purposefully lost games in his first three seasons, dude was trying. Maybe when the opposing team is announced boo or if a kid brings it on himself taunting, but that's it. If it was Henne at a Heat game then ok, he's a professional, but not even a fan of that.

    The 4th and 20 drop and the pass to Harrelson in between the corner and safety to move them closer to FG range I won't forget, but think the play I'll remember most is the touchdown right before halftime. Has pressure from the right, rolls out to his left and throws a perfect 39 yard pass to Highsmith with 27 seconds left before halftime. Yates reminds me of Matt Ryan some. I said some and not saying he'll have the same amount of success his first three years as Ryan but their size, demeanor, neither are complete statues in the pockets, etc. Their last years in college Yates has a higher completion percentage, higher YPA, less interceptions, and a higher rating; though Ryan had less sacks, more yards and touchdowns, and attempted a lot more passes.
     
  28. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    To update my thoughts on Yates, one reason I'm uncomfortable is because of all the short throws and check downs.

    I just tallied up his entire NC State and Florida State games. I counted 68 aimed throws with an average throwing distance of about 19.0 yards. For perspective, Christian Ponder's average throwing distance on his aimed throws was about 24.0 yards against North Carolina. The disturbing thing though is that only 19 of the 68 throws (about 1 in 4) traveled 20+ yards through the air, with only 1 in 5 traveling 25+ yards. The rest is all dink and dunk. Again for comparison, with Christian Ponder, 24 of 35 of his throws went 20+ yards, and 14 of 35 went 25+ yards. That's 2 of 3 and 2 of 5, respectively.

    But the flip side is...when T.J. Yates HAS thrown at distance, he's been pretty accurate. For instance, on those 19 throws, he completed 16 of them. One of the incompletions was a pure drop, and both others were near-misses on balls that traveled 45 and 50 yards through the air (we're talking off by maybe a yard, if that). That's pretty insane accuracy at distance. Ponder was 15 of the 24, with 2 of the incompletions being drops.

    This is why T.J. Yates is such an enigma...especially as you try and compare him with a Christian Ponder. Everything I've learned about being fearful of the check down king makes me say that Ponder's game against UNC was more impressive than Yates' games against NC State and Florida State. But that insane accuracy on 20+ yard throws, when he does throw them, keeps me intrigued. My gut makes me go with Yates.
     
  29. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Bump...doing pretty well today. Beating Falcons.
     
  30. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Mentioned it in the game thread. Good for him. If he keeps this up, who knows. Maybe he can make Schaub expendable.
     
  31. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Here were my updated thoughts on Yates a few months later after his pro day:

     
  32. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    I loved Yates. A shame we couldn't grab him
     
  33. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    8.6 YPA in the first quarter, and I think he’s still out-YPAing Tom Brady today. Very impressive.

    How’d Ireland miss this guy?
     
  34. NorFlaFin

    NorFlaFin Active Member

    I"d like to have John Shoop as the next OC.
     
  35. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Yeah...no thanks. Watched enough of Carolina footage while researching Yates to be totally turned off by his play calling which reminded me so much of Dan Henning's that it was maddening.
     
  36. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    whoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooores!
     
  37. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Mother Yates didn't survive the background check...
     
  38. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think we need to wait a little bit before saying how could Ireland miss on this guy. It's been one game.
     
  39. Destroyer

    Destroyer There for every play.

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    Celebrating this guy after a game and a 1/4 but Moore gets no credit after 5 really solid games. Grass is always greener.
     
  40. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    T.J. Yates is a rookie that, as late as 2 months prior to the draft, nobody thought was even draftable. He just led a win over a team that will probably be in the playoffs. Matt Moore is in his 5th year as a pro, his 31st game seeing action, and he had an 86 passer rating in a game where we ran for like 200 yards.

    A little perspective here.
     
    ssmiami and Desides like this.

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